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Dragon Expansion


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#1 Old Master

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 07:20 AM

Excuse me if you feel I'm stepping ahead but since the dungeon expansion, I wonder if we are going in the same direction as with the 3rd edition.

What I mean by this is: in 3rd edition if you had the dungeon of doom, city of adventure and dragon's tower you would meet at the end of these expansions respectively the lord of darkness (strength 6) the wraith lord's (craft 6) the eagle king (strength 6) and last the dragon king (strength and craft 12 each) so that at the end of 3 out of 4 corner you would have to fight a boss with strength or craft of 6 (city corner has no boss) so you could be strong enough to beat a corner boss but not be strong enough to beat the dragon king who sit in the middle of the main board to get the crown of command!

Now with the new dongeon,the lord of darkness have been increase to strength and craft 12, and on most game played if you beat the lord of darkness getting to the valley of fire is almost a walk in the park (you only need a talisman).

My point is that we'll need a very awesome dragon king to make it much harder to get to the crown, if we keep the same ratio from the 3rd edition, this dragon king will have to be stength and craft of 24!!

If it doesn't happen we may have to make house rule to bring him up but for those who don't own a copy of 3rd edition with it's cones and if FFG doesn't include some more with future expansions  then player may have to take pen and paper to keep tracks of how much strength and craft they have as there is not enough of them in the main box (well not for 4 or 5 player anyway)

So what do you think?

Cheer



#2 Velhart

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Posted 14 June 2009 - 08:20 AM

Old Master said:

 

Excuse me if you feel I'm stepping ahead but since the dungeon expansion, I wonder if we are going in the same direction as with the 3rd edition.

What I mean by this is: in 3rd edition if you had the dungeon of doom, city of adventure and dragon's tower you would meet at the end of these expansions respectively the lord of darkness (strength 6) the wraith lord's (craft 6) the eagle king (strength 6) and last the dragon king (strength and craft 12 each) so that at the end of 3 out of 4 corner you would have to fight a boss with strength or craft of 6 (city corner has no boss) so you could be strong enough to beat a corner boss but not be strong enough to beat the dragon king who sit in the middle of the main board to get the crown of command!

Now with the new dongeon,the lord of darkness have been increase to strength and craft 12, and on most game played if you beat the lord of darkness getting to the valley of fire is almost a walk in the park (you only need a talisman).

My point is that we'll need a very awesome dragon king to make it much harder to get to the crown, if we keep the same ratio from the 3rd edition, this dragon king will have to be stength and craft of 24!!

If it doesn't happen we may have to make house rule to bring him up but for those who don't own a copy of 3rd edition with it's cones and if FFG doesn't include some more with future expansions  then player may have to take pen and paper to keep tracks of how much strength and craft they have as there is not enough of them in the main box (well not for 4 or 5 player anyway)

So what do you think?

Cheer

 

 

Hi Old Master,

I agree that if the Dragon King will come with his servants into the Talisman world, then the Dragon King, must be stronger than the Lord of Darkness.

But he must not be too strong because the game takes already a lot of time.

I am thinking more about a strength 16 dragonKing !

The Wraith Lord and the Eagle King will probably be as strong as the Lord of Darkness..

I can't wait for a Dragon expansion and the Dragon Tower

FEEL MY WRATH OF POWER, YOU PESKY HUMANS !

Challenge me !

       

Maybe for the future? We will see !

 

 



#3 Old Master

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 02:23 AM

Hi Velhart

I must admit that i've played with all existing commercial expansion since 1st edition but the dragon expansion from 2nd

I never saw it in store and my friends never knew it existed at the time, no internet back then

But i've downloaded the card template and looked at them and they seems very interesting,they would make a nice complement to a dragon tower

If you've played with it let me know of your experience.

As for the dragon king at 16, I'm not too sure, this is still quite close to 12

Cheer

 



#4 Velhart

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 04:34 AM

 

The Second story of Talisman

Long long ago..

It is said that in times past, darkness was triumphant and evil enveloped the land. Then a mighty adventurer arose and used the mystic might of the Crown of Command to banish evil and restore order. For generations he ruled wisely and was well-loved by all the people of the land. But even the mightiest must pass, and the adventurer died leaving no worthy successor. The long Golden Age of peace and plenty was over. A new age of terror had begun.


From storm-darkened skies the Dragon King descended, a being of near infinite power and malevolence. With him came a legion of evil dragons, each scarcely less powerful than their dark master. Savagely the Dragon King crushed all resistance and forced the enslaved people of the land to build huge Temples to his glory. One of those temples has become the lair of the ferocious Dragon King !

The land quakes beneath the Dragon King's oppressive rule and the only hope is that a new generation of noble adventurers will arise and free them.

~The End

 



#5 Velhart

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 05:02 AM

Old Master said:

Hi Velhart

I must admit that i've played with all existing commercial expansion since 1st edition but the dragon expansion from 2nd

I never saw it in store and my friends never knew it existed at the time, no internet back then

But i've downloaded the card template and looked at them and they seems very interesting,they would make a nice complement to a dragon tower

If you've played with it let me know of your experience.

As for the dragon king at 16, I'm not too sure, this is still quite close to 12

Cheer

 

Hi Old master,

Yes, i have played several times with the Dragon Tower

It's a Tower made of cardboard and there are 2 floors + the top one where the dragon King sits. and contain only one space.

As i said before, i really like the tower

But the tower is actually very short and in 3 a 4 turns, you are already at the top of the tower.

There was a realm die added to the board( same as the regions) where you can not move faster than 4 spaces or lower !

But after all, it's one of the best expansions ever made !

You also encounter the Wizard from the Talisman story(first story 2th/4th edition) who has become a lich(enemy), and lives inside the tower !

I will add a picture to get a look at the old tower !

 



#6 Old Master

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 05:43 AM

Velhart said:

Old Master said:

 

Hi Velhart

I must admit that i've played with all existing commercial expansion since 1st edition but the dragon expansion from 2nd

I never saw it in store and my friends never knew it existed at the time, no internet back then

But i've downloaded the card template and looked at them and they seems very interesting,they would make a nice complement to a dragon tower

If you've played with it let me know of your experience.

As for the dragon king at 16, I'm not too sure, this is still quite close to 12

Cheer

 

 

 

Hi Old master,

Yes, i have played several times with the Dragon Tower

It's a Tower made of cardboard and there are 2 floors + the top one where the dragon King sits. and contain only one space.

As i said before, i really like the tower

But the tower is actually very short and in 3 a 4 turns, you are already at the top of the tower.

There was a realm die added to the board( same as the regions) where you can not move faster than 4 spaces or lower !

But after all, it's one of the best expansions ever made !

You also encounter the Wizard from the Talisman story(first story 2th/4th edition) who has become a lich(enemy), and lives inside the tower !

I will add a picture to get a look at the old tower !

 

Hi Velhart,

Sorry if it wasn't clear but I do own the dragon tower from 3rd edition, it's the dragon expansion from 2nd that I never played

You know the one with many dragons in the adventure deck (the cover that you show in your previous replies right under "Challenge me")

BTW you made a great job with the painting on your dragon as I could see from the picture

Cheer



#7 Velhart

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 05:58 AM

Old Master said:

 

Velhart said:

 

Old Master said:

 Hi Velhart,

Sorry if it wasn't clear but I do own the dragon tower from 3rd edition, it's the dragon expansion from 2nd that I never played

You know the one with many dragons in the adventure deck (the cover that you show in your previous replies right under "Challenge me")

BTW you made a great job with the painting on your dragon as I could see from the picture

Cheer

 

 

Hi Old Master,

That's not my dragon lol

I have just find it on the internet to show you the picture, but it seems you have the tower already

But in the Dragon expansion , there are around 18 a 20? dragons in the deck !

Most dragons have a strength of 8 ! They are brothers of the Dragon King who sits on the top of the Tower

The other 60 cards are very interesting. I like the objects in that expansion, but the other cards too off course, but i have never play that expansion. My old father owns it !!

PS: Have you read the story that i have posted above?( The dragon tower story is very short...) I hope you have enjoy it..

 



#8 Old Master

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 07:02 AM

Hi Velhart,

Yes I did read your story and it was very entertaining

Keep writing

Cheer



#9 Velhart

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:09 AM

Old Master said:

Hi Velhart,

Yes I did read your story and it was very entertaining

Keep writing

Cheer

It was a official story from the Dragon expansion, but i have add some text from the Dragon Tower to complete the story !



#10 akuma508

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 12:40 PM

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.



#11 Velhart

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 11:09 PM

akuma508 said:

 

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.

 

 

Why did not you like it then?

If i look to the cards, i must say that the objects in the dragon expansion are very interesting

And if we add 18 to 20 dragons, then the main board becomes more dangerous..

 



#12 akuma508

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 12:40 AM

Velhart said:

akuma508 said:

 

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.

 

 

Why did not you like it then?

If i look to the cards, i must say that the objects in the dragon expansion are very interesting

And if we add 18 to 20 dragons, then the main board becomes more dangerous..

 

 

From what I remeber it weighted the game to much towards dragons and not other emery's. Also there were way to many objects just for dragon stuff. The broad got fulled up with crap objects no-one wanted. 

The dragon tower looks interesting tho. 



#13 Velhart

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 01:00 AM

akuma508 said:

Velhart said:

 

akuma508 said:

 

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.

 

 

Why did not you like it then?

If i look to the cards, i must say that the objects in the dragon expansion are very interesting

And if we add 18 to 20 dragons, then the main board becomes more dangerous..

 

 

 

 

From what I remeber it weighted the game to much towards dragons and not other emery's. Also there were way to many objects just for dragon stuff. The broad got fulled up with crap objects no-one wanted. 

The dragon tower looks interesting tho. 

I can understand your point.

From the 80 cards, there are only around 18 a 20 dragons and the other 60 are a lot of stuff etc

But maybe that FFG can find a good balance for it.

And in the 4th edition, there are a lot of more cards than usual ( see dungeon expansion etc

 



#14 Old Master

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 05:13 AM

Velhart said:

akuma508 said:

 

Velhart said:

 

akuma508 said:

 

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.

 

 

Why did not you like it then?

If i look to the cards, i must say that the objects in the dragon expansion are very interesting

And if we add 18 to 20 dragons, then the main board becomes more dangerous..

 

 

 

 

From what I remeber it weighted the game to much towards dragons and not other emery's. Also there were way to many objects just for dragon stuff. The broad got fulled up with crap objects no-one wanted. 

The dragon tower looks interesting tho. 

 

 

I can understand your point.

From the 80 cards, there are only around 18 a 20 dragons and the other 60 are a lot of stuff etc

But maybe that FFG can find a good balance for it.

And in the 4th edition, there are a lot of more cards than usual ( see dungeon expansion etc

 

You are both right in sugesting that FFG will balance the dragon expansion when it come out

If we look at what was done for dungeon, we can expect that it will be awesome, and have much more fearsome dragons than the 2nd edition who had only dragons with maximum 8 strength

Akuma508 I agree that there seems to be a lot of dragon related object in that expansion which of course is kinda normal for a dragon expansion but maybe Game Workshop didn't pay as much attention to the balance of the game at that point and just hope it wouldn't be intrusive since there was already plenty of adventure cards if you own all previous 2nd edition expansion

My favorite edition of Talisman (not counting 4re) is the 3rd, there was a lot of good expansion for 2nd with good ideas  but I really hate knowing that the next adventure card was from the main game or XXXX expansion due to the different color hue in the back "light green, not so light green and dark green" I was very happy that it was fix in the 3rd and that it was consistent

I'm also very happy to see the same care put into the 4re edition as the back of cards is the same for adventure deck be it from the main game or reaper or dungeon, John Goodenough mention many time "game balance" in interview so we may not have to worry about this

Cheer



#15 Velhart

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 05:42 AM

Old Master said:

Velhart said:

 

akuma508 said:

 

Velhart said:

 

akuma508 said:

 

If they were doing that, around 18 for the end boss would be good.

I never liked the dragon expersion for 2nd ed. We ended up removing it.

 

 

Why did not you like it then?

If i look to the cards, i must say that the objects in the dragon expansion are very interesting

And if we add 18 to 20 dragons, then the main board becomes more dangerous..

 

 

 

 

From what I remeber it weighted the game to much towards dragons and not other emery's. Also there were way to many objects just for dragon stuff. The broad got fulled up with crap objects no-one wanted. 

The dragon tower looks interesting tho. 

 

 

I can understand your point.

From the 80 cards, there are only around 18 a 20 dragons and the other 60 are a lot of stuff etc

But maybe that FFG can find a good balance for it.

And in the 4th edition, there are a lot of more cards than usual ( see dungeon expansion etc

 

 

 

You are both right in sugesting that FFG will balance the dragon expansion when it come out

If we look at what was done for dungeon, we can expect that it will be awesome, and have much more fearsome dragons than the 2nd edition who had only dragons with maximum 8 strength

Akuma508 I agree that there seems to be a lot of dragon related object in that expansion which of course is kinda normal for a dragon expansion but maybe Game Workshop didn't pay as much attention to the balance of the game at that point and just hope it wouldn't be intrusive since there was already plenty of adventure cards if you own all previous 2nd edition expansion

My favorite edition of Talisman (not counting 4re) is the 3rd, there was a lot of good expansion for 2nd with good ideas  but I really hate knowing that the next adventure card was from the main game or XXXX expansion due to the different color hue in the back "light green, not so light green and dark green" I was very happy that it was fix in the 3rd and that it was consistent

I'm also very happy to see the same care put into the 4re edition as the back of cards is the same for adventure deck be it from the main game or reaper or dungeon, John Goodenough mention many time "game balance" in interview so we may not have to worry about this

Cheer

There are 2 dragon prince's with a strength of 9 !  Or maybe 3?...

The others are strength 8 or lower.

I agree that it is very important that all adventure cards have the same color on the back side

We don't have to worry about the balance. I am sure that FFG will add more cards to the dragon expansion to find a balance with the other main deck adventure cards.

 



#16 Velhart

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 11:36 AM

If FFG will publish a new Dragon Tower, i think that we get a very large tower then !!

The revised board is larger than the Third edition board

Maybe we can walk a lot of more spaces on the first and second floor !

I am also wondering how FFG will make the tower Maybe cardboard again or some better material !!



#17 Velhart

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 01:08 AM

I have take a look at the Black Tower custom expansion from Carsten Both  for 2th edition at Talisman Island, and i must say that it looks very interesting !

If FFG makes the spaces in the tower also like a Chimney room, Sarcophagus, Gallery room(from the old wizard) Guard rooms, that would be very interesting !

It's worth to take a look there



#18 Old Master

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 06:28 AM

Thanks for pointing it out Velhart

I will indeed take a closer look to that one.

Cheer



#19 Old Master

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 07:05 AM

I've look into this expansion, very well done and lots of interesting ideas like you mention before. If taken as is we would need the Timescape expansion to play it though since there is a lot of spaces pointing to it 

Would you prefer this type of single level expansion or the dragon 3rd edition multilevel type?

Cheer



#20 talismanisland

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 07:56 AM

Talking of the feared Timescape expansion. People who have the 2nd Edition expansion will soon be able to play with 4th Revised when I post a little something...


Harbourmaster at Talisman Island - 15 magical years and counting!

Sometimes I even update the Talisman Island Facebook Page!




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