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Horizons d20 vs. Linear 6


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#1 Wu Ming

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Posted 24 November 2008 - 06:23 PM

To those who have or have seen both version of the game. I'll likely be able to pick up a copy of the Horizon d20 version of Grim very cheaply, however I am not at all a fan of teh d20 system, nor do I relish teaching it to my likely Grim players or running it. The Linear 6 Version thoung looks to be close to 15-40 USD more than the d20 version. My question, aside from the actualy engine is the material in the two books the same? I've gone through the d20 version (mostly skimmed just to make sure the world was what I thought it was from the FFG site) and from what I've seen I am pretty interested. I am just currious if the only diffrence between the two is the system -- or if the newer L6 version contains more non 'crunch' aspects then the previous d20 incarnation.

Thanks for any asisstence, in advance.



#2 Santiago

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 12:21 AM

 

I thought Grimm by FFG had its own system and wasn't leaning on Hasbro's D20 anymore...
 


We need more non-d20 fantasy rpg's...there are too few of those...



#3 Wu Ming

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 12:47 AM

There is the Linear 6 version of Grimm (the one I am after truth be told) but its around 60 USD, there is also the Horizon d20 Version which I have actually seen and fliped through and was suprised by the presens of feats and othe rd20 Staples until I saw the big red bar at the top of the cover claiming its d20 status.

I want to play Grimm with my wife & mum but don't want to teach my wife yet another system, she's still comming to grips with WFRP mechanics. Linear 6 from what I've seen is very simple an dteh L6 Character sheet is 1 page, 1 side and seems very simple it looks to be more 'crunch lite' than the d20 version which I am hoping means more actual source material or what I consider to be actual content. That's why I'm trying to see if any has or has seen both version to confirm or deny this sumption of mine.



#4 fenist

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 08:27 AM

well i like, de linear 6



#5 Wu Ming

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 08:48 AM

The d20 version has a page count of around 60 pages while the L6 version seems to be a prodigious 224 pages, 16 pages of which are full-color. I feel like a complete heel there has to be major diffrences to account for that spread as far as the page count goes. Also the price on the site keeps changing in the online store it was 49 USD and then in the Catalogue it was only 39 USD. So I guesse I've esentially answered my own question. Still though if anyone has played both versions or owns both I would still be interested in a run down / compare and contrast of the systems /  books.



#6 Ikeas

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 10:41 AM

Hi everyone!

Im new in this community, and I have log in only for ask about this game. I have some questions, and I would  feel very grateful if someone could answer them.

-Can someone tell me how works the d6 linear system? Im very intrested in such kind of things, and it could be the difference about to buy or not the game.

-Its this game (Grimm) going to be translated to the Spanish or going to be traded to Spain? If yes, can you tellme when?

 

Thank you very much for your answers, and sorry for my English, if any mistake was done!



#7 Ikeas

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 10:44 AM

Hi everyone!

Im new in this community, and I have log in only for ask about this game. I have some questions, and I would  feel very grateful if someone could answer them.

-Can someone tell me how works the d6 linear system? Im very intrested in such kind of things, and it could be the difference about to buy or not the game.

-Its this game (Grimm) going to be translated to the Spanish or going to be traded to Spain? If yes, can you tellme when?

 

Thank you very much for your answers, and sorry for my English, if any mistake was done!



#8 Bad Dog

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Posted 25 November 2008 - 05:43 PM

I actually own both copies; although I only just acquired the L6 version, so have not read it in entirety yet.  I can try to answer your questions, but I would not consider myself an authority.  I may have more answers later, as I read more.

I picked up the d20 version first, because it was cheap, and the premise looked interesting.  I am not a fan of the d20 system myself; but it was enough to convince me that it would be worthwhile to special order the L6 edition from my local retailer.

The L6 version has a lot larger page count.  This is due in part to having a complete system, instead of relying on the d20 system for its game mechanics.  The first 100 pages or so are dedicated to rules.  The L6 system is very simple.  For an idea of how it works, check out the FFG site for Grimm: http://new.fantasyfl...ia/lineard6.pdf

Like I said, I haven't yet finished reading the book yet, so I don't really have much to add to the description of the game mechanics right now.

As for game world, NPCs and adventure ideas, in the d20 book that amounts to only 20 pages of material.  In the L6 version, it is just over 100 pages.  Now some of that (about 20 pages) is going to be taken up by printing stats for creatures that the d20 version will use the Monster Manual as a reference for, But that still means the L6 version has FOUR TIMES as much material on the world, and significant NPCs.  So, unless you are a big d20 fan, and plan on drawing a lot of material from other d20 sources, the L6 version is the one I would recommend.



#9 Wu Ming

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Posted 26 November 2008 - 12:31 AM

Thanks alot Bad Dog, this is exactly the kind of information I was after, and truth be told, prior to your post I had almost convienced myself to get this game, and now it's a pretty much a done deal. If there wasn't too much diffrence in source material I was thinkng of doing the d20 becasue of the price diffrence but it sounds like my asumption infered from the page count was correct. If I get this, which I think I will, I'll also try to write up a comparsion between L6 and d20. Again thanks Bad Dog!



#10 jadrax

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Posted 26 November 2008 - 12:58 PM

Bad Dog said:

The L6 system is very simple.  For an idea of how it works, check out the FFG site for Grimm: http://new.fantasyfl...ia/lineard6.pdf

Like I said, I haven't yet finished reading the book yet, so I don't really have much to add to the description of the game mechanics right now.

Call me Thicko McThicky, but that .pdf did not really help me visualise how the system works, Could someone give me an explanation of the basics?



#11 Bad Dog

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Posted 26 November 2008 - 09:32 PM

Sorry.  After another look I realized that the pdf was only really clear if you understood what it represented.  The diagrams are a nice reminder, such as you might find on a GM screen, but they are not great as a teaching tool, unless you are using them to illustrate points that you are making.  So here are those points:

Without getting into modifiers, exceptions, etc. the basic trait test works like this:

  • Every trait has a grade (as listed on the character's sheet), and every test has a grade (as set by the GM).
  • In order to succeed, the character's trait grade must equal or exceed the grade of the test.
  • Before comparing his character's trait to the test's difficulty, the player will roll 1d6
  • On a roll of 2-5 there is no change to the character's trait grade; it is a staight comparison.
  • On a roll of 6, the character's trait will increase by one grade, and the player will roll again (and again) until a 1-5 is rolled. The trait's grade increases for each 6 rolled. When the rolling is comlete, compare the trait's final grade to the test's grade (difficulty).
  • On a roll of 1, the character's trait will decrease by one grade, and the player will roll again (and again) until a 2-6 is rolled. The trait's grade decreases for each 1 rolled. When the rolling is comlete, compare the trait's final grade to the test's grade (difficulty).

There you have it; the core mechanic behind the Linear 6 system.  I hope that was easier to understand.



#12 jadrax

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Posted 26 November 2008 - 10:18 PM

Much easier. Thanks!



#13 Janus

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Posted 27 November 2008 - 04:35 PM

 I'm a much biggger fan of the Linear d6 game rules for Grimm than the d20, though I think the d20 version was lightyears better than most of the d20 material published at the time.

One of the things that I think the full Ld6 version has an advantage over the d20 rules is that the Linear System feels like you're playing kids in these fairytale realms.  I also think the Archetype mechanics are much better represented than the rules given for the d20 conversion that came first and acted as a sort of "Beta Test" for the RPG.  Beyond the Linear d6 rules feeling a lot better than the d20 rules, I also say that the world itself is much better represented in the full hardcover game, and more campaign options given to have fun with.  For this reason I say that the purchase of Grimm Hardcover is a great addition to any RPG collection, and the absolute satisfaction of a quality one-book RPG is worth the cost.

Now, this does not mean the game is for everyone.  I do not recommend the game if you want tactical gameplay, complex combat, and a chance to heavily mod the system into some other sort of game from the one in the book.  It's emphasis really is for quick play fun, storytelling, and childlike imagination against dark and twisted nightmares.  Hopefully this and the other posts help some more with your decision.

 



#14 moekel

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Posted 28 November 2008 - 05:43 AM

thanks for the info!



#15 Janus

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Posted 28 November 2008 - 06:48 AM

 My pleasure!



#16 Xytonion

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 12:55 AM

All my questions answered in one topic ;) Thanks all.



#17 evilbob

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Posted 24 July 2009 - 07:22 AM

Another quick thought on the OP's question:  the newer book seems intended to replace the old one.  The old one feels extremely clunky comparatively.  The old version required an extensive knowledge of d20, and then how to bend or change those rules for this system.  It was trying to force something that didn't quite fit, and it shows.

 

By contrast, the new system seems more like it was built with the setting in mind, and so it is much better suited to the setting.  It is extremely light (although as some have said, there can be quite a bit of depth if you want it) and you can easily explain pretty much everything someone needs to know in a few minutes.  The fact that the character sheet is just one page should be a great sign.

 

And as others have pointed out, the new, thick book is chock full of content.  A little less than half introduces the world and how to make a character and play in it - effectively a "players' handbook" - and the rest for the narrator's use - effectively a "DM's guide" and "monster manual."  I sincerely doubt - especially 2 years later - that any other supplements will arrive for this system, but as others have said, this book is really all you need.






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