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Can you to space and do nothing?


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#1 Tuomas85

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 01:12 PM

I remember that this might have been answered but just wanted to clarify. e.g. if you have to choose between a space that has dragon strenght 7 and space with stablescard, can you move to space with stablecard and not buy anything just to prevent you from fighting dragon?

 

 

EDIT: sorry about missing word on topic. ment "Can you *move to space and do nothing"


Edited by Tuomas85, 31 January 2014 - 01:13 PM.


#2 Hunter Smith

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 01:54 PM

Yes you can



#3 DomaGB

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 05:53 PM

I asked this a few months back and was told no. For example 2nd edition Talisman you MAY roll in the Temple, now in 4th ed they removed the word may. I also was told that you can't go to a place and not buy, or go to the doctor and not heal, you then have to visit the enchantress or mystic...



#4 Hunter Smith

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 07:07 PM

Yes but if you go to a card that sells something and have no gold, you still can move to that square.



#5 DomaGB

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 08:11 PM

If there is more than 1 card, you have to do the lowest # 1st.



#6 The_Warlock

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 05:37 AM

You're talking about completely different things as they were one.

 

The OP asked: "can you move to a space and do nothing"? The answer is neither Yes or No; it's "it depends on the space and the situation on that space".

 

In case your movement roll brings you either to a space with a Dragon or a space with a Stables card, nothing in the world would force you to move in a specific direction (except Misdirection Spell or similar effects).You always move in the direction you wish.

 

Then there's a big difference between "Draw card spaces" and "Non-Draw Card spaces".

On the Draw-Card spaces, you either draw cards or encounter faceup cards on the space. Landing on a faceup Livery Stables card is not different than encountering the card when it is drawn: if you draw it and have no gold, do you think you're forced to buy something? You can't do that in any possible way, so the only possible outcome would be to quit and reload a saved game... ooops this is the board game, so you can't do that.

 

On Non-Draw Card spaces (City, Village and many others) you first encounter any cards that may have been placed there, then you must follow the instructions on the space. Since the instructions on City and Village didn't seem mandatory to many people, FFG has introduced since a long time a FAQ that clearly states as follows:

 

City
Q: When a character encounters the City, can he choose an
option that cannot be fulfilled, like visiting the Doctor if he
already has life counters equal to his life value? What about
the Village?

A: No. If a character visits the Doctor, he must spend at least
1 gold to heal, and only if he has fewer life counters than his
life value. If a character visits the Alchemist, he must turn at
least one of his Objects into gold. If he is not able to fulfil any

of these conditions, he must visit the Enchantress. If a character
encounters the Village, he must choose an option that he
is able to fulfil; otherwise he must visit the Mystic.

 

I'd like to stress that there's always one option that you can fulfill in City and Village, while there are no options if you encounter a card like the Livery Stables and have no gold. So you can land on that card and do nothing, instead of fighting a dangerous Dragon in the other direction. That's perfectly fine and part of normal gameplay.


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#7 DomaGB

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 10:49 AM

woops, I did miss that one, thought it was the same space! Talking about choosing between 2 spaces, not really 2 different cards. I agree you always can choose a space and fail to activate the card on that space. Perhaps a wish for evil characters and your good, and so on.



#8 Tons-Home-rules

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 05:50 AM

Fair enough, Warlock.  I just find it confusing, well, ok, inconsistent, that, if you have a bucket full of Gold...

 

1-You can go to the Livery Stables card and not be forced to buy a horse.  You can land and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

2-You can go to the Village, but can NOT just land there and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

 

Yeah, it's a board game (fyi, sarcasm much?).  But my personal preference are uniform rules and not a, say, "here's a store you have to buy" "here's another store you don't have to buy" (or any other board game rules that pop the "except" clause), but hey, those are the rules, those are the rules. 

 

It just doesn't seem like an important enough gameplay changer since there are tons of "MAY" (i.e. avoidable) places and strangers that are safe "do nothing" spots if those cards are drawn.

 

But that's just me, I guess.


Edited by Tons-Home-rules, 06 February 2014 - 05:51 AM.


#9 Rigmaster

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 06:15 AM

Fair enough, Warlock.  I just find it confusing, well, ok, inconsistent, that, if you have a bucket full of Gold...

 

1-You can go to the Livery Stables card and not be forced to buy a horse.  You can land and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

2-You can go to the Village, but can NOT just land there and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

 

 

I  would argue that you encounter the space and your character doesn't know if there's a livery stable in the woods or on a field, but knows there's a village down the road (there are road signs telling him that at least...) and goes there with a purpose. But I see your point. They could have added a tavern in the village as well, where you could go for a well-earned drink and perhaps roll die and if it's a 1 you get too drunk and miss your next turn. That would be purpose enough for me... ;)


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#10 The_Warlock

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 12:49 PM

 

Fair enough, Warlock.  I just find it confusing, well, ok, inconsistent, that, if you have a bucket full of Gold...

 

1-You can go to the Livery Stables card and not be forced to buy a horse.  You can land and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

2-You can go to the Village, but can NOT just land there and "buy nothing" even though you have the gold.

 

 

I  would argue that you encounter the space and your character doesn't know if there's a livery stable in the woods or on a field, but knows there's a village down the road (there are road signs telling him that at least...) and goes there with a purpose. But I see your point. They could have added a tavern in the village as well, where you could go for a well-earned drink and perhaps roll die and if it's a 1 you get too drunk and miss your next turn. That would be purpose enough for me... ;)

 

Instead of a tavern, the Village has a Mystic with the same purpose (i.e. you go there if you don't want to spend your gold at the other shops).

 

There's no shop where you MUST buy something. The rule is uniform about that. The Village and City spaces have received a rule that prevents safe landing there, but forces to visit at least the Mystic or the Enchantress.

 

It's a rule, ignore it if you feel it troubles you. I apply it regularly because it is a good rule.



#11 Tons-Home-rules

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 03:06 PM

Ok.  Thank you both for the replies.

 

Edit = Actually, in the City you can't go to a shop and "do nothing", but maybe I'm reading p.8 "Encounters in shops" wrong.

 

Anyhow, thanks for the replies.


Edited by Tons-Home-rules, 06 February 2014 - 03:09 PM.


#12 The_Warlock

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 10:34 AM

Ok.  Thank you both for the replies.

 

Edit = Actually, in the City you can't go to a shop and "do nothing", but maybe I'm reading p.8 "Encounters in shops" wrong.

 

Anyhow, thanks for the replies.

 

Yes, but again, don't mix different things together.

 

The City Expansion added a new Region which is called "City Region". There's the special rule that you can't enter a Shop Space and do nothing, and that's valid only in the City Region and on Shop Spaces. The reason behind this is to discourage characters from entering Shop Spaces just to avoid drawing City Cards. In those shops, you must follow the instructions on the space and this always requires to spend gold or something else, but in the City layout entering in a Shop Space is always a voluntary move.

 

The "City" I was talking above is the City space, which is on one of the 4 corners of the main board. That space received a FAQ .

 

Cards that sell items don't have such restrictions, because they will generate unsolvable problems if they did (you draw such a card, you don't have gold, but you must buy... quit and load saved game).


Edited by The_Warlock, 07 February 2014 - 10:38 AM.


#13 Tons-Home-rules

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 04:46 PM

Thank you.  I understand, I'm just biased against "special rules".  I've done a shift from lots of rules (hence my board name) to nice simple uniform stuff, due to off topic stuff, heh. 

 

(Sidebar = My friends and family don't share my new outlook, hence the frustration that creeps into my posts.  Hopefully you didn't feel that too much of that was directed at you.  If so, I apologise.)

 

Anyhow, thanks for explaining.  I just wish that all spots were MAY, instead of MUST, that all draw spaces were "Draw 1" no matter what, but hey, that's just me...

 

Thanks again.



#14 DomaGB

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 05:47 PM

2nd edition has lots of "may's" maybe you can try that edition? I play both.


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#15 Tons-Home-rules

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 11:03 PM

I'll look into it.  Thank you for the tip.



#16 The_Warlock

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Posted 08 February 2014 - 04:31 AM

Thank you.  I understand, I'm just biased against "special rules".  I've done a shift from lots of rules (hence my board name) to nice simple uniform stuff, due to off topic stuff, heh. 

 

(Sidebar = My friends and family don't share my new outlook, hence the frustration that creeps into my posts.  Hopefully you didn't feel that too much of that was directed at you.  If so, I apologise.)

 

Anyhow, thanks for explaining.  I just wish that all spots were MAY, instead of MUST, that all draw spaces were "Draw 1" no matter what, but hey, that's just me...

 

Thanks again.

 

Making uniform wordings and rules should be one of the highest priorities when designing a game, especially new components. The "special rules" and FAQs are often a way to sort problems that have escaped design or playtesting, or have been added during those phases as a quick fix.

 

I would like to have the same rule applied everywhere as well, but I recognise that the reason behind the exception to the rule is more important than applying the same rule everywhere. Talisman is a game about words, more words than rules, and this generates a lots of problems when a basic rule, a new wording and an old wording don't mix well.



#17 Alfax

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 02:03 AM

I also have to agree that cards on spaces in a region don't fall under the "you can't go here and do nothing" rule. The shops in Cities are separate and out of the way so they do not HAVE to be entered. If you are on the outer region of the main board it's possible for you to roll a die and be right between to stable cards so that you have no choice but to move to one. Since that's a possibility having to encounter that card can't be as strict as shop spaces in cities.






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