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Plot Phase responses


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#1 Chip Damage

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 11:58 AM

I was looking at the flow chart of the plot phase of the FAQ and noticed something startling. It shows that there is no window for player actions between revealing plot cards and resolving their effect. So does this mean that if my opponent activates valor maghulis I cannot save my characters since there is no window to respond or take player actions?

#2 ktom

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 01:22 PM

The short answer is "no, you are allowed to save."

 

The detailed answer here is that, while you are correct that there is no room to take standard player actions between revealing plots and resolving their effects, you should keep in mind that Response effects are not considered to be standard player actions.

 

Every action window goes through the basic process of "initiate-interrupt (i.e., save/cancel)-resolve-passive-response." It's a little more complicated in a busy framework action window like revealing/resolving plots, but the basics that Responses (whether they are save/cancel responses or regular responses) take place as part of the larger timing window.

 

Specifically, the "full" order of the "reveal/resolve plots" framework window, including the timing basics of all framework action windows, looks like this:

 

1a: Initiate choose/revealing plots (All players choose and flip their plots at the same time)

2a: Save/Cancel opportunity against revealing plots

3a: Resolve choose/reveal plots (Plots are officially the "current" plots, and their effects active)

 

1b: Initiate counting/comparing total initiative value

2b: Save/Cancel opportunity against counting/comparing initiative

3b: Resolve counting/comparing total initiate (High player officially "wins" initiative count for the round)

 

1c: Initiate determination of First Player (High player chooses new FP)

2c: Save/Cancel opportunity against determining FP

3c: Resolve determination of FP (Chosen player officially becomes FP for the round)

 

4a: "When revealed" plot text initiates in order determined by FP.

4a.i: Initiate first "when revealed" plot text (e.g.: Valar initiates and all characters are set to die)

4a.ii: Save/cancel against first "when revealed" plot text (e.g.: Players can save characters set to die for Valar)

4a.iii: Resolve "when revealed" plot text (e.g.: Valar resolves, players not saved in 4a.ii officially die/become moribund)

Repeat 4a.i - 4a.iii for each "when revealed" plot

 

4b: Passive effects to anything that happened in 1a-4a.iii each goes through "initiate-save/cancel-resolve" (e.g.: this is where you draw the card for Golden Tooth Mines)

 

5: Responses (that do not use the word "save" or "cancel") to anything that happened in 1a-4b (or earlier in 5) each goes through "initiate-save/cancel-resolve"

 

6: Close action window (and put all moribund cards in their corresponding "out-of-play" area).

 

 

 

That's the full timing order, combining all basics and other timing rules, for revealing/resolving plots.



#3 kauai1964

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 01:23 PM

No.  Save/Cancel Responses are a special case, and do not need a Player Action window.

 

The previous page in the FAQ explains how this works:

 

1. Framework event initiates.

2. Save/cancel responses to framework event.

3. Framework event resolves.

4. Passive abilities (now triggered) are resolved.

5. Responses



#4 Chip Damage

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 02:10 PM

Oh I see where the confusion lay for me. Thanks for the clarification

#5 HastAttack

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:25 AM

As a excercise in timing, I assume the following would be correct:

 

One player plays Valar and I win initiative with my plot card

 

Characters are killed for Valar - one of my characters is Aeron Damphair

If Aeron Damphair would be killed, instead search your deck for a non-unique Holy character with cost 3 or lower, put it into play, shuffle your deck and put Aeron Damphair on the bottom of your deck.
 

I find a Drowned Fanatic and put him into play

Response: After you win initiative, discard the top 2 cards of each opponent's deck.
 

I assume that I can now trigger Drowned Fanatic's response and discard 2 cards of each oppenent's deck?



#6 -Istaril

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 06:58 AM

As a excercise in timing, I assume the following would be correct:

 

One player plays Valar and I win initiative with my plot card

 

Characters are killed for Valar - one of my characters is Aeron Damphair

If Aeron Damphair would be killed, instead search your deck for a non-unique Holy character with cost 3 or lower, put it into play, shuffle your deck and put Aeron Damphair on the bottom of your deck.
 

I find a Drowned Fanatic and put him into play

Response: After you win initiative, discard the top 2 cards of each opponent's deck.
 

I assume that I can now trigger Drowned Fanatic's response and discard 2 cards of each oppenent's deck?

 

That's correct. Aeron's ability completely resolves before you move to step 5 (responses)






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