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Righteous Fury


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#21 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 08:58 AM

I have used using the pre-errata weapon stats in conjunction with BC/OW rules, and they work reasonably well in Deathwatch. The nerf to autofire really reduces the effectiveness of the heavy bolter in itself (2 fewer hits on average). I might also bring over the BC/OW Righteous Fury rules, which would also make NPCs much more dangerous, though that would entail getting rid of Volatile and Deathwatch Training.

 

To use the errata stats in Deathwatch, I think I would, instead of increasing weapon damage, convert Unnatural Toughness over, using Toughness 40 as the baseline. So UTx2 would become UT+4, UTx3 would be UT+8, etc. Something like that. That might deal with the large number of Deathwatch NPCs with Toughness that make them immune to 1d10+9.



#22 Kshatriya

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 09:52 AM

BC/OW RF rules are a lot of fun, my players like it a lot more than straight damage because of the status effects. However, I've left Deathwatch Training - no need to confirm a crit. And I've changed Volatile (which has always been wonky with Deathwatch Training in play): it simply adds a flat 1d10 actual damage as well as the 1d5 "critical" OW effect. It's worked well so far.

 

I mention changing weapon stats because my players would riot if I changed unnaturals, haha. The Devastator is already disappointed about his heavy bolter going from +20 to hit to -10. But when you consistently hit 8 DoS with that thing, the problem is apparent.



#23 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 10:21 AM

Something else you could do if you wanted to change the Unnaturals is do what it looks like FFG did in BC/OW, which is to just translate from TT.

 

The mechanics in TT and the RPG work differently of course, but if you look at the NPC stat blocks and compare them with TT, the various levels of Toughness Bonus appear to be correlated with the weapon stats.

 

By which I mean, if a weapon can hurt something in TT, it should be able to do it in the RPG.

 

So for example everything with a T6 or lower in TT can be hurt by an S3 weapon. Ergo, this is also the case in the RPG, which is why I assume nothing other than Daemon Engines (and Greater Daemons with Daemonic factored in, and the Leviathan from Tome of Blood) has a Toughness Bonus higher than 11 -- correlating with a laspistol doing 1d10+2 in standard mode.

 

In general, it seems to translate like this:

T2 = TB2 (Gretchen and such)

T3 = TB3-5 (human range)

T4 = TB6 or 8 (Orks, Space Marines -- Orks in BC/OW get True Grit and marines don't, so they are actually roughly equivalent despite Orks having a lower TB)

T5 = TB9-11

T6 = TB12

T7+ = TB13+ (undamagable by an S3/1d10+3 weapon disregarding Righteous Fury)

 

(Weapon damages and AP values translate similarly, with the caveat that certain qualities, mainly Flame, that increase lethality over time translate to lower immediate damage, and Tearing translates to higher damage.)

 

Armour values translate similarly (the one exception I can think of offhand is the Bloodthirster):

 

ArS 6+ = AP2-3

ArS 5+ = AP 4-5

ArS 4+ = AP6-7

ArS3+ = AP8-10

ArS2+ = AP11-14

 

(Weapon Pen values are correlated with this; if a TT weapon can ignore a 6+ armour save, it has a Pen of 2-3 in the RPG.)

 

So a Carnifex (T6 ArS3+ in TT, if I member correctly) should have TB12 AP8-10 (probably 10). Which makes it hurtable (sans RF) by both an Astartes bolter and a normal heavy bolter -- but not much.


Edited by bogi_khaosa, 05 January 2014 - 11:40 AM.


#24 Visitor Q

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 08:14 AM

As mentioned Rules As Written I think it is Touched by Fates that allows NPC to use RF.  However I have found things a lot quicker, more lethal, and more fun if RF can used by everyone (including hordes) and auto confirms.    It makes battles very tense knowing that a lucky hit coudl fell one of the Battle Brothers.


Edited by Visitor Q, 13 January 2014 - 08:15 AM.


#25 Kshatriya

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 06:59 PM

Autoconfirm for everyone vs everything greatly obviates the value of Deathwatch Training.



#26 herichimo

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 11:01 PM

"Congratulations Astartes! You've just went through 2 weeks of Hypno-training to be just as deadly as you were before!"



#27 Calgor Grim

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 07:10 AM

I usually reserve the benefits of criticals for major NPCs and villains and not bother with giving them fatepoints. This is because I like my big villains to be able to stand out and unleash terrifying reserves of power against the unlucky protagonists. I wouldnt want some lowly minion to be able to get a lucky shot and kill a player, that's the job of his superior! :)


Edited by Calgor Grim, 14 January 2014 - 07:11 AM.

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#28 Visitor Q

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Posted 15 January 2014 - 02:27 PM

Autoconfirm for everyone vs everything greatly obviates the value of Deathwatch Training.

 

Yep.  So I allow re-rolls to damage on the second RF dice roll to take into account Death Watch Training.

 

"Congratulations Astartes! You've just went through 2 weeks of Hypno-training to be even more deadly"






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