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Strength calculation question


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#1 Arguyle

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 09:09 AM

So I'm making a Storm Warden for a PBP game I'm joining (holy crap I get to be a player!) and I'm doing my armor history and I notice the wording for Enhanced Strength...

Enhanced Strength: Increase the Battle-Brothers Strength by +20. The effect on the SB is calculated after the Unnatural Statistic modifier. 

What I understand that to mean is:

My strength is 40 I have an Unnatural statistic bonus of 8.
Normal power armor gives me +20 so....
My strength is 60 I have an Unnatural statistic bonus of 10.
I have the "Thy Strength be legend" armor history which provides another +10 so....
My strength is 70 I have an Unnatural Statistic bonus of 11. 
Ummm that doesn't feel right, but by the words of the book  its spot on. 70(11). Wow Space marine STRONK. 

I also checked the errata, I found no mention of it only applying to the Strength Bonus (SB), which further reinforces my belief that this is the correct way to do this but I'd still really like to get some clarification if anyone has some to offer. thanks in advance. 



#2 Fgdsfg

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 09:36 AM

I may be wrong, but that all looks correct to me.


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#3 Arguyle

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 10:37 AM

I may be wrong, but that all looks correct to me.

That's what worries me. 



#4 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:08 AM

What's the problem?



#5 Arguyle

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:11 AM

What's the problem?

the number seems outrageously high, also everyone else in the game has their math wrong if I'm right. 



#6 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:37 AM

Well a statistically average starting SM should have a Strength of 41 + 20 for armour = 61 with an SB of (4x2) + 2 = 10, so unless the other characters are unusually weak they should be about that.

 

It's not that good. If you're using the post-errata weapon stats you'll be doing 1d10+14 with a chainsword as opposed to 1d10+9 with a bolter. Pre-errata 1d10+14 vs. 2d10+5, which is actually slightly worse/about the same


Edited by bogi_khaosa, 24 November 2013 - 11:38 AM.


#7 Arguyle

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:43 AM

Well a statistically average starting SM should have a Strength of 41 + 20 for armour = 61 with an SB of (4x2) + 2 = 10, so unless the other characters are unusually weak they should be about that.

 

It's not that good. If you're using the post-errata weapon stats you'll be doing 1d10+14 with a chainsword as opposed to 1d10+9 with a bolter. Pre-errata 1d10+14 vs. 2d10+5, which is actually slightly worse/about the same

Yeah it seems that no one was adding in the strength just the +2 to their SB and moving on which is fine-ish. just shorting themselves on strength tests. 



#8 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:51 AM

 

Well a statistically average starting SM should have a Strength of 41 + 20 for armour = 61 with an SB of (4x2) + 2 = 10, so unless the other characters are unusually weak they should be about that.

 

It's not that good. If you're using the post-errata weapon stats you'll be doing 1d10+14 with a chainsword as opposed to 1d10+9 with a bolter. Pre-errata 1d10+14 vs. 2d10+5, which is actually slightly worse/about the same

Yeah it seems that no one was adding in the strength just the +2 to their SB and moving on which is fine-ish. just shorting themselves on strength tests. 

 

 

They... basically made themselves into regular people in power armour. :)



#9 Arguyle

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 11:58 AM

 

 


 

Yeah it seems that no one was adding in the strength just the +2 to their SB and moving on which is fine-ish. just shorting themselves on strength tests. 

Well a statistically average starting SM should have a Strength of 41 + 20 for armour = 61 with an SB of (4x2) + 2 = 10, so unless the other characters are unusually weak they should be about that.

 

It's not that good. If you're using the post-errata weapon stats you'll be doing 1d10+14 with a chainsword as opposed to 1d10+9 with a bolter. Pre-errata 1d10+14 vs. 2d10+5, which is actually slightly worse/about the same

 

They... basically made themselves into regular people in power armour. :)

 

So what your saying is... I'm not crazy. and Space Marines have retartedly high stat caps on strength.  55+20=75(x2)+30=18 unnatural strength

18!
HERPA DERPA bat **** high. 



#10 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 12:16 PM

Nay your math is wrong. You multiply the strength bonus, not the strength. So...

 

(7 x 2) + 3 = 17.

 

So one lower. :)

 

It is somewhat lower in the post-Deathwatch FFG games because Unnatural Characteristics work differently.



#11 pearldrum1

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 08:50 PM

 

What's the problem?

the number seems outrageously high, also everyone else in the game has their math wrong if I'm right. 

 

 

I see what you mean now. This was the first thing I asked Inq6 when I took Thy Strength be Legend for my PA history. Exactly how you worked it out.



#12 Kshatriya

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 09:13 PM

 

What's the problem?

the number seems outrageously high, also everyone else in the game has their math wrong if I'm right. 

 

(1) It's not that high.

 

(2) They're gonna need it.



#13 Arguyle

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 12:56 AM

 

 

What's the problem?

the number seems outrageously high, also everyone else in the game has their math wrong if I'm right. 

 

(1) It's not that high.

 

(2) They're gonna need it.

 

compared to the 40-50 im used to as the accepted norm 52-70 is a 20% change in chance of success at rank 1. A 1/5th boost in effectiveness is a large change. 
I cannot contest your second point. 



#14 Arguyle

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 12:59 AM

Nay your math is wrong. You multiply the strength bonus, not the strength. So...

 

(7 x 2) + 3 = 17.

 

So one lower. :)

 

It is somewhat lower in the post-Deathwatch FFG games because Unnatural Characteristics work differently.

HUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRR IM GUD AT MAF!
yeah I can only count to four, I dont know why I thought for some reason 75 turned in to 7.5 and thats 15! Not  75/10 round down is 7. SMRT.  still 17 is what the **** imo. 



#15 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 09:58 AM

 

Nay your math is wrong. You multiply the strength bonus, not the strength. So...

 

(7 x 2) + 3 = 17.

 

So one lower. :)

 

It is somewhat lower in the post-Deathwatch FFG games because Unnatural Characteristics work differently.

HUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRR IM GUD AT MAF!
yeah I can only count to four, I dont know why I thought for some reason 75 turned in to 7.5 and thats 15! Not  75/10 round down is 7. SMRT.  still 17 is what the **** imo. 

 

 

He will do 1d10+17 with his fist. :)

 

1d10+20 with a chainsword.

 

It's really not that high, as said above (as far as damage goes). Depending on which weapon stats you are using, a standard bolt pistol does 1d10+9 or 2d10+5, and in the latter case can fire full auto.



#16 Kshatriya

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 12:25 PM

High SB is important in keeping melee competitive with the nastier and bigger ranged options, which have the advantage of not needing special Talents to hit multiple times from one shot and, of course, the huge advantage of not needing to be in melee to use them.



#17 CaptainStabby

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:17 PM

 

He will do 1d10+17 with his fist. :)

 

 

 

 

 

And thats why I laughed so hard in the Price of Hubris scenario that has the optional duel encounter. I was reading it again last night and thinking... "A SM is just going to punch this dudes head clean off." Which at that point in the scenario, I'm all for tbh. :)


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#18 pearldrum1

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:22 PM

And now I am looking at my PCs stat blocks and realizing that up until this point (which isn't bad since it is still super early in the game) They have all been using and fighting with their pre-power armor +20 scores.

 

So let me try and work this out, even though it has been previously done in this thread, just so it is solidified in my head.

 

My Assault Marine has a Str 40, SB 8 unarmored. In Armor he has a Str 60, SB 10. Right? OK, good so far. He uses a Chainsword primarily so according to the Errata he should deal 1d10+13, correct? And with his fists he should deal 1d10+10, same as Combat Knife?



#19 bogi_khaosa

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:48 PM

And now I am looking at my PCs stat blocks and realizing that up until this point (which isn't bad since it is still super early in the game) They have all been using and fighting with their pre-power armor +20 scores.

 

So let me try and work this out, even though it has been previously done in this thread, just so it is solidified in my head.

 

My Assault Marine has a Str 40, SB 8 unarmored. In Armor he has a Str 60, SB 10. Right? OK, good so far. He uses a Chainsword primarily so according to the Errata he should deal 1d10+13, correct? And with his fists he should deal 1d10+10, same as Combat Knife?

 

Right, right, right. The only advantage of the combat knife is that it has Pen and you can parry with it.

 

(Not meaning to bring up other game lines over and over, but this isn't the case in Black Crusade, b ecause Space Marines there do not have Unarmed Master be default.)



#20 pearldrum1

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:54 PM

No worries. I have not played another 40K RPG. Deathwatch is my one and only... so far.

 

And as such, I do not know by heart what Unarmed Master grants. I would guess it negates any penalties to fighting without a weapon and helps solidify the Killing Machine image of Astartes.






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