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Curse and stun


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#1 wolf269

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 01:14 AM

With curse you can't use actions or skills with the arrow sign, and with stun you must use your first action (with arrow) to get rid of it.

 

So if a hero is both cursed and stunned can he not do anything until he passes the knowledge check for curse or loses the condition in some other way (items etc.)?

 

 



#2 zangetsu666

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 02:00 AM

Dont have cards in front off me but I think being stuned just takes away your first action. Even if you arrboth stunned and cursed you would roll for the curse check before doing anything else pretty sure though that you could move with your second action or attack stun dosent remove your whole turn just the first action.

#3 C2K

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 04:33 AM

I think the OP is correct.  Cursed and Stunned is a nice combo. 



#4 Underworld40k

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 05:28 AM

Would need to double check but i agree with OP as well, the stun removal is an action with the arrow icon, curse would prevent that being used to discard stun. Nasty combo.



#5 zangetsu666

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 05:47 AM

Yea couldnt rember if stun had the arrow or not but you would presumably test for your curse at the start of your turn and if you pass the check then your free to remove the stun. It also helps to have the apothecary or disciple to heal conditions to

#6 rfisha

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 05:52 AM

The stun could come before the curse though allowing you to take an action and then apply curse???  That's a good one



#7 Husker949

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 07:30 AM

Stun only requires an action to remove, not using the action arrow. So even if cursed you can remove stun. The other thing to remember is that you test to remove curse at the start of your turn, so if you pass its gone, otherwise you have to still spend an action.



#8 No Hero

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 09:08 AM

OP is correct, and removing Stun specifically requires an arrow action (I have the card with me atm)

Luckily for the heroes there's not many monsters / cards that stun... Far more that curse!

It's also interesting to wonder how stun interacts with Syndrael's feat. Can the target stunned hero perform the move action? In theory the stun condition states that "this is the only action that you can perform DURING YOUR TURN", and though I'd say it would be in the spirit of the rules to apply it to actions performed outside the turn as well, feats are often the exception...



#9 Robin

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 10:34 AM

OP is correct, and removing Stun specifically requires an arrow action (I have the card with me atm)

 

Yep.

stunned.jpg cursed-front.jpg


Edited by Robin, 12 November 2013 - 10:35 AM.

An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered.
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#10 griton

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 10:47 AM

Cursed (emphasis mine): You cannot use monster actions or skills denoted with a :arrow: At the start of your turn, test :knowledge:. If you pass, discard this card or token. If you fail, keep this card or token.

 

Stunned (emphasis mine): :arrow:: Discard this card or token. This is the only action you may perform on your turn while you have this card or token.

 

Cursed does NOT prevent you from becoming un-stunned. It only prevents you from using SKILLS that have an arrow, not any action (which is what an arrow denotes). As such, even if you failed, you could still remove Stunned, could still move, attack, etc.

 

As for Syndrael's feat, since the move action is NOT on your turn, she could use it to give a stunned hero a move action. Note that stunned isn't intended to prevent heroes from doing anything. They can still spend fatigue to move and use skills that don't require actions. Being that Stunned and Syndrael's feat were part of the same expansion, I believe the "on your turn" was specifically added to allow for such a case.


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#11 No Hero

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 11:15 AM

Cursed (emphasis mine): You cannot use monster actions or skills denoted with a :arrow: At the start of your turn, test :knowledge:. If you pass, discard this card or token. If you fail, keep this card or token.

 

Stunned (emphasis mine): :arrow:: Discard this card or token. This is the only action you may perform on your turn while you have this card or token.

 

Cursed does NOT prevent you from becoming un-stunned. It only prevents you from using SKILLS that have an arrow, not any action (which is what an arrow denotes). As such, even if you failed, you could still remove Stunned, could still move, attack, etc.

 

As for Syndrael's feat, since the move action is NOT on your turn, she could use it to give a stunned hero a move action. Note that stunned isn't intended to prevent heroes from doing anything. They can still spend fatigue to move and use skills that don't require actions. Being that Stunned and Syndrael's feat were part of the same expansion, I believe the "on your turn" was specifically added to allow for such a case.

Nice catch! Thank you



#12 Husker949

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 12:58 PM

Thanks for the pics Robin, and while I was wrong about Stun not having an arrow icon it does fall under the realm of not being a monster ability or hero skill as Griton has pointed out. Good to know I have ruled that one right for my group as well. :)



#13 Sleepwalker42

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 01:15 PM

Yeah, the "skills" parts solves it. combo isn't as good as hoped.



#14 Robin

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 02:08 PM

Thanks for the pics Robin, 

"Stole" the pics here : http://www.descentinthedark.com/2nd/


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An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered.
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#15 Robin

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 02:09 PM

Cursed (emphasis mine): You cannot use monster actions or skills denoted with a :arrow: At the start of your turn, test :knowledge:. If you pass, discard this card or token. If you fail, keep this card or token.

 

Stunned (emphasis mine): :arrow:: Discard this card or token. This is the only action you may perform on your turn while you have this card or token.

 

Cursed does NOT prevent you from becoming un-stunned. It only prevents you from using SKILLS that have an arrow, not any action (which is what an arrow denotes). As such, even if you failed, you could still remove Stunned, could still move, attack, etc.

 

As for Syndrael's feat, since the move action is NOT on your turn, she could use it to give a stunned hero a move action. Note that stunned isn't intended to prevent heroes from doing anything. They can still spend fatigue to move and use skills that don't require actions. Being that Stunned and Syndrael's feat were part of the same expansion, I believe the "on your turn" was specifically added to allow for such a case.

Thanks for the good rule interpretation.

Learning every day.  ;)


An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered.
G. K. Chesterton

#16 C2K

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 07:13 AM

Ah, it's monster action.  Forgot that was on the card.  :lol:



#17 Ser Folly

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Posted 18 April 2014 - 03:48 AM

Thanks for the pics Robin, and while I was wrong about Stun not having an arrow icon it does fall under the realm of not being a monster ability or hero skill as Griton has pointed out. Good to know I have ruled that one right for my group as well. :)

 

Sorry to put this one onto the fire again but we just started with LoR and there are some major issues with the stupid German translation. (I don't know who is doing that, sometimes sounds like a computerised translation.) 

 

We had some problems with cursed...and thus my question: What are SKILLS with an arrow icon? Only the cards heroes buy for XP? That would make curses very formidable if putt on a monster as they are actually down to move and attack actions, but it wouldn't hinder heroes too much, at least at the stage we are at by now.

 

Thanks for your help!


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#18 Zaltyre

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Posted 18 April 2014 - 07:58 AM

 Only the cards heroes buy for XP? That would make curses very formidable if putt on a monster as they are actually down to move and attack actions, but it wouldn't hinder heroes too much, at least at the stage we are at by now.

Exactly.



#19 Steve-O

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Posted 18 April 2014 - 08:51 AM

Sorry to put this one onto the fire again but we just started with LoR and there are some major issues with the stupid German translation. (I don't know who is doing that, sometimes sounds like a computerised translation.)


I wouldn't be entirely surprised if they were using a computer to translate everything and then just giving it a once-over with human eyes to clean up the most obvious syntax errors.

We had some problems with cursed...and thus my question: What are SKILLS with an arrow icon? Only the cards heroes buy for XP?


Yes, a Skill is a class card that isn't starting equipment. Hero abilities and feats are "abilities" but not "skills."

"Monster action" is any special ability described on the monster card that requires an action to perform.

Cursed definitely hurts monsters more than heroes. Same with the new condition from Trollfens (Weakened) - it requires a Rest Action to remove, but monsters cannot take a Rest Action. I guess the logic is that monsters are disposable anyway, so it doesn't impact balance too much to have them hit harder by these conditions.

#20 Ser Folly

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Posted 18 April 2014 - 10:23 AM

 


Cursed definitely hurts monsters more than heroes. Same with the new condition from Trollfens (Weakened) - it requires a Rest Action to remove, but monsters cannot take a Rest Action. I guess the logic is that monsters are disposable anyway, so it doesn't impact balance too much to have them hit harder by these conditions.

 

Disposable yes, but it might get nasty with some monsters that rely on monster actions to work effectively (like elementals?). Heros might decide not to kill them to leave them wandering without a rewspan (cursefree).

 

Fortunately none of my heroes is able to curse a monster so far. I hope it will stay this way.

 

By the way, the German card for SIGN OF WEAKNESS gives a healer immobility which is a joke as he'll lose that condition end of turn. But that seems to be a sign of a Mental Error with human origin ;-)


Descent - Star Wars LCG - Netrunner - X-Wing - Arkham Horror - Elder Sign - Battlestar Galactica - Warhammer: Diskwars - Kingsburg - Edge of the Empire - Civilization - Bloodbowl Teammanager - Rune Age - Letters from Whitechapel - Cadwallon - Lord of the Rings LCG ... looks like I love FFG stuff :huh:





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