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Warlord Titan Hold and Lighter Bay


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#1 Sebastian Yorke

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Posted 11 November 2013 - 02:03 PM

Warlord Titan Hold and Lighter Bay        
For Grand Cruiser, Mass Conveyor or Battlecruiser.
Power: 4    
Space: 5
SP: 5
Contains a single Warlord titan and related lighters/repair workshops.

 

Only trusted in the hands of the most influential Rogue Traders on the AdMechs.

Should've an extensive background describing its origin and how the Imperium did not claim it back. Could've been bargained with an RT over specific agreements (such as this machine will never be used against non-chaos tainted humans) in exchange for Archeotech or STC recovered.


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#2 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 10:45 AM

I feel that your campaign must be about to include one hell of a planetary invasion....greater daemons and battle titans, eh?

 

I would say that seems too big, but I guess if you're including a titan dropship as well.... probably fair enough.



#3 Sebastian Yorke

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 11:58 AM

The titans don't need a dropship to enclose them (armor and void shields are more than enough for a re-entry), I understand they are dropped from orbit and then retrieved by engines that are attached to them on demand for that sole purpose.

And you are right, the space includes workshops for eventual repairs needed, ammo, spare "parts" (armor plates), the "dropship engines", moderatti/princeps/skitarii/tech priests accommodations, etc...


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#4 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 05:24 AM

The titans don't need a dropship to enclose them (armor and void shields are more than enough for a re-entry), I understand they are dropped from orbit and then retrieved by engines that are attached to them on demand for that sole purpose.

 

Whether for re-entry, or impact, or simple controllability of the drop, titans are dropped in either specialised titan barges (See Titan) or in what are essentially titan-scale drop pods (see Galaxy In Flames); they aren't just thrown out of a ship in orbit.

 

I'm certain that they can take the heat of re-entry, but it's controllability to hit a target drop point precisely and impact at terminal velocity which are the issues. That and the fact that like it or not they are priceless religious artefacts...


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#5 CaptainRemiVandigrath

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:21 AM

Well, if it takes up space 5 on a ship that big, I think there's still plenty of room to keep the drop pod too. My feeling on the AdMech is that they'd use the drop pod as the storage cask too, like a mobile resting hanger for the Titan. Everything would revolve around the Titan and its drop pod inside the hanger facility.

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#6 Sebastian Yorke

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 10:05 AM

Sorry, I wanted to convene that the engines would also be used for the re-entry - I completely agree with you that an impact in terminal velocity would cause great damage.

I just think that a titan "drop pod" don't need to be fully enclosed. But most likely something that resembles much larger versions of those "engines" that the Imperial Guard uses in Dawn of War 1 for unloading their prefab structures.


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#7 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 07:03 AM

Doesn't need to be, but - at least for those we've seen in stories - is.



#8 Kasatka

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 06:36 AM

Warlord Titan Hold and Lighter Bay        
For Grand Cruiser, Mass Conveyor or Battlecruiser.
Power: 4    
Space: 5
SP: 5
Contains a single Warlord titan and related lighters/repair workshops.

 

Only trusted in the hands of the most influential Rogue Traders on the AdMechs.

Should've an extensive background describing its origin and how the Imperium did not claim it back. Could've been bargained with an RT over specific agreements (such as this machine will never be used against non-chaos tainted humans) in exchange for Archeotech or STC recovered.

As obtaining the titans themselves should be worked into the campaign i would suggest that the component doesn't come with any titans - simply the housing space for the titans, maintenance equipment and the landers to fly them to the surface and back.

To factor in the titans being separate i would also drop the SP cost to 2, and the space to 4 (5 is the size of some weapon components which are far bigger than titans!).

Also perhaps say the bay can house a team 2 scout titans (warhounds etc) or 1 battle titan (reaver, warlord etc). Maybe even a team of Knights (4 to 5 knights seems reasonable).


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#9 SirFrog

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 11:06 AM

Actually, I can't imagine why you could only fit 4-5 knights in such an enormous space.

Consider the following: Judging from the size on the leaked pictures on Knights recently (and taking into account the Dreadknight, which independent of its silliness is the correct size, they're not that big. Even if they'd require enormous amounts of space formaintenance, I can't see why that would take up a whopping 4 Space. Compare it to a basic Jovian Escort Bay, which incidentally also takes 4 Space, and that has capacity to hold and maintain as much as 20 fighters, as well as the neccesary docking and launching gear. Then, remember that a Knight is likely smaller (or, at the very least, the size of) each of those fighters.

EDIT: Actually, nevermind the Dreadknight comparison. That miniature is somewhere around 10 cm, with the true Knight being roughly 21 cm. The point still stands, though.

Edited by SirFrog, 21 February 2014 - 02:02 PM.


#10 Kasatka

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 08:51 AM

I was operating on the provision that whilst strike craft and the likes can be maintained by your ships crew and some minor Ad-mech operatives, Knights are still ancient relics and so will require a bigger presence of Ad-mech. The replacement parts, modular weapon fits etc would also take up far more space than the STC gear on strike craft, indeed if your ship has a small-craft repair bay it can produce said gear but there's no way to have a titan/knight repair facility currently so i was effectively rolling it into one component in my mind.
I concede if you take out the support staff, components and facilities and literally just have a hangar full of Knights and their transport craft then you could either fit in more or cut the size of the bay...


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#11 Annaamarth

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 06:49 PM

What about a Mechanicus War-Relic Facility?

 

P:3 S:6 SP:3

 

"This facility includes all of the maintenance equipment and lifting capacity to maintain the holiest War-Relics of the Adeptus Mechanicus.  The facility may be configured to contain a Baneblade reinforced company (4 Baneblade-type tanks), three Warhound Scout Titans, a Warhound and a Reaver, or a Warlord Battle Titan, as well as the heavy lift capacity to offload them onworld- but not the capacity to hot drop them (as in the Astartes' favored Steel Rain tactic).

 

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Relics of the Ancient Mechanicus: +10 to all interaction tests toward Adeptus Mechanicus if this component was acquired legitimately.  If not, +10 to all interaction tests toward Dark Mechanicus..."


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#12 WilliamAsher

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 07:00 PM

My players field a single Knight piloted by their Magos and retrieved from an ancient space hulk.  I ruled that a single Knight temple would require 1 power and 1 space.  The Knight itself could be stored in a small converted part of the cargo bay (-25AP due to reduced space) or Barracks (Counts as two companies of troops).  The Knight Temple allows major repairs, training, munitions and parts storage, and such.  The players opted for the Magos' ship to include the Temple.  I also allow them to deploy it to defend the Main Processional and landing bays.  The last boarders found that to be quite the deterant...



#13 MorioMortis

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Posted 30 March 2014 - 09:22 PM

What about a Mechanicus War-Relic Facility?

 

P:3 S:6 SP:3

 

"This facility includes all of the maintenance equipment and lifting capacity to maintain the holiest War-Relics of the Adeptus Mechanicus.  The facility may be configured to contain a Baneblade reinforced company (4 Baneblade-type tanks), three Warhound Scout Titans, a Warhound and a Reaver, or a Warlord Battle Titan, as well as the heavy lift capacity to offload them onworld- but not the capacity to hot drop them (as in the Astartes' favored Steel Rain tactic).

 

Heavy Metal: +350 points toward any military Endeavour in which heavy armour can be deployed.

 

 of the Ancient Mechanicus: +10 to all interaction tests toward Adeptus Mechanicus if this component was acquired legitimately.  If not, +10 to all interaction tests toward Dark Mechanicus..."

 

Just something to point out here, but I think your scaling is a bit off; Super-heavy tanks are much smaller than even Warhounds, and they require a lot less specialized maintenance (the only unique thing on them, if any, is the main gun, whilst titans and their ilk are a wholly different thing to what the average Ad Mech goon is used to dealing with). This only gets worse with the bigger classes of titans; a Warlord is going to require a lot more room than 4 super-heavies just to fit it in, much less have the thing be available for deployment or emperor-forbid doing any maintenance on it.

 

Indeed, super-heavies aren't that big, all things being relative and considering the size of the average space fighter, while titans are both bigger and a lot more annoying to deal with due to their shape (they are tall objects, which takes a lot more room) and much greater inherent complexity. That, and whilst a tank can be parked in any room that is big enough to hold it and hopefully has a large enough door for it to pass through (it's probably able to shoot one though), titans are literally walking relics, many of them being part of Legions with histories as storied as Space Marine Chapters, and have Machine Spirits that make them more like angry animals when awoken than ordinary vehicles, so you probably want to avoid having them feeling "penned in" or "insulted" by their surroundings.


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#14 Annaamarth

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 05:53 AM

 

What about a Mechanicus War-Relic Facility?

 

[Fluff and rules stuff]

Just something to point out here, but [Fluff-stuff followed]...

 

:)  Okay.  That's all fluff stuff, with no direct effect on anything from the perspective of the ship, right?  My concern was more for component balance- if you can convince the GM to let you have eight or ten baneblade variants, I doubt the Rules Police will come bashing in your door.

 

Whatever your GM wants to let you field during your away missions is his business- but he might like to use my component as offered for the sort of benefits is provides relative to the costs it levies.

 

Tabletop points-wise, I think the Baneblade is 500 pts while the Warhound is 750 (could be out of date information), which would mean 3 Baneblades per 2 Warhounds- so yeah, I shorted the tanks by that method.  

 

Not stressing it.


Edited by Annaamarth, 01 April 2014 - 05:54 AM.

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#15 Amazing Larry

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 03:20 PM

While I'm sure Titan Legions maintain specialized transports I don't see why those would be 100% necessary just for transporting and dropping one. Seems to me you could just slap a geller field on the titan and tow it and whatever it's drop equipment is behind the ship.



#16 Annaamarth

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 12:42 AM

I am disinclined to agree, mostly because no agent of the AdMech would permit one of the god-machines to be so risked.

 

Remember that Titans have a very, very powerful machine spirit.  Functionally, they are Limited A.I. (opinion, but pretty close in all fluff of which I am aware).  Why would you risk contaminating a Titan in that way?

 

Moreover, gellar fields are not trivial components.  They are not small, just because they don't take up space.  You could no more mount a gellar field on a titan than you could an advanced shipmounted Augery Array, like the... Deep Void array, is that it?  The super-fancy one in the core book whose name escapes me.

 

Those antennae and receivers are huge, as are their power requirements, and no Titan could support them.  Similar cases apply to gellar fields.  The best you could do would be to slap some hexagrammatic wards on the thing.  Lots and lots of hexagrammatic wards.  And hope they don't get damaged by combat.


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#17 Amazing Larry

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 03:20 AM

Titans have void shields right? As I understand it even on a ship it's all the same emitters just a different shield which is why you have to choose which one you want up the void shield or the geller. As big as a Titan is and with the powerplant it has I don't see why it couldn't mount a geller field especially if you mounted it externally.

 

Better yet if you're that worried about it build it a barge and tow that, maybe it's just me but I'm loath to overspecialize one of my own frontline ships in such a way. The Mechanicus isn't going to just give you a Titan to have forever and do whatever you like with, so why throw all your resources at being their damn cabby? I'm just saying more cost effective methods I think.



#18 Nameless2all

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 05:07 AM

Titans have void shields right? As I understand it even on a ship it's all the same emitters just a different shield which is why you have to choose which one you want up the void shield or the geller. As big as a Titan is and with the powerplant it has I don't see why it couldn't mount a geller field especially if you mounted it externally.

 

Better yet if you're that worried about it build it a barge and tow that, maybe it's just me but I'm loath to overspecialize one of my own frontline ships in such a way. The Mechanicus isn't going to just give you a Titan to have forever and do whatever you like with, so why throw all your resources at being their damn cabby? I'm just saying more cost effective methods I think.

You are right about the business aspect of the endeavor.  Why would you convert your vessel for a temporary mission with the Ad-Mech?  Not very cost effective.  Think about it this way though.  The Ad-Mech would probably want to know how you are transporting one of their most holy of relics/creations.  And simply towing it behind your ship or placing it in a bin on the outside, would probably have them cancelling the loan agreement, and irking them for the near future.  By going Annaamarth's route, you are showing respect and reverence for one of their most holiest of creations, and more than likely they would assist you in ensuring the storage facility is adequate and to their specifications prior to shipment.  What do you do with the equipment once the contract has ended?  Well, that's for you to decide and the Ad-Mech to not care-about (to a certain extent). 

 

Obviously, if you happen to stubble upon a lost Titan somewhere, and not having the capabilities or time to make the Warlord Titan Hold and Lighter Bay, then towing it or placing it on the outside could be argued with in your favor.  Especially if it's a time sensitive discovery with Orks/Rak'Gol/Pirates/Chaos closing in behind you.


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#19 Annaamarth

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 01:11 PM

Using inline comments for point-by-point.

Titans have void shields right? As I understand it even on a ship it's all the same emitters just a different shield which is why you have to choose which one you want up the void shield or the geller. As big as a Titan is and with the powerplant it has I don't see why it couldn't mount a geller field especially if you mounted it externally.

Re: emitters- maybe.  Dunno.  Bearing in mind the existence of miniaturized, extremely rare void shields (if they weren't rare, they'd be on Baneblades), I am willing to accept the postulate that miniaturized, extremely rare gellar fields might exist.  I'd also expect them to be archeotech, or secrets of the AdMech, much like Titan void shields are.  You might be able to do it if you had the means (and a cooperative GM), such as a fantastic reputation in the AdMech.

 

 

Better yet if you're that worried about it build it a barge and tow that, maybe it's just me but I'm loath to overspecialize one of my own frontline ships in such a way.

Frontline ships?  Oh, heavens no.  I can imagine no reason to mount this in anything less than a dedicated transport, a grand cruiser, or a multirole Mass Conveyor- they make great planetary invasion ships. That would, of course, require a huge profit factor to support (as expected for someone fielding titans), so there you go.

 

The Mechanicus isn't going to just give you a Titan to have forever and do whatever you like with, so why throw all your resources at being their damn cabby? I'm just saying more cost effective methods I think.

Yeah. This is why most RTs don't have a Titan.  Being their 'cabby' does take a lot of resources, and they (probably) won't let you keep the titan.  You might be able to trade for their support somewhere else though- move a Titan somewhere in exchange for access to the Lathe shipyards?  Perhaps some Best (or Best++) quality Ryza macrobatteries?  If the paycheck is worth it, I'll drive anyone around.

 

You start towing their God-Machine through the warp though, kiss your good reputation with the AdMech, your access to the Lathe yards, and most future Mechanicus contracts goodbye.  Just my expectation.


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#20 Nameless2all

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 02:11 PM

You know, that might be a good story arc.

 

Somewhere in the warp, is a Imperator-class Titan.  Long ago, a daring RT decided to tempt fate by towing it with his Cruiser, through the warp.  Either fate or ill misfortune befall the RT, as the chain broke during voyage.  Lost to the currents, it drifts ever on.  Some say they can hears it's voice in the warp when traveling close to the Heathen Stars.  Some say its a tone full of sorrow and solitude hoping someone will find it, others a blare of wraith and fury at the fools who left.  However, there is one thing they all agree on.  It's voice yearns for what it was created for.  War.......


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