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Conquest and Defiance


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#1 Skowza

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 06:04 PM

So this is an odd new mechanic. Lanni has a reason to use Infamous now, and I really hope there is no way to give Prized to opponents cards.

#2 Skowza

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 06:08 PM

And actually it looks like the Traitor Attachment probably does just that.

#3 Tomdidiot

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 07:38 PM

So this is an odd new mechanic. Lanni has a reason to use Infamous now, and I really hope there is no way to give Prized to opponents cards.

 

New blackfish gives prized to all characters killed for claim.
 



#4 Skowza

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 09:49 PM

I assume that if an Event gets cancelled then so does the Prized power?

#5 sWhiteboy

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 10:18 PM

I'm assuming so.  I mean, if you cancel Forever Burning, then Deathbound doesn't work.



#6 Khudzlin

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Posted 06 November 2013 - 06:16 AM

Actually, according to the explanation, Prized is tied to the event being played (while Deathbound is tied to the event resolving successfully). So if a Prized event is cancelled, the power is still claimed (like it still counts for usage limits).



#7 jasonconlon

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Posted 06 November 2013 - 08:27 AM

Prized. I've been in two minds about whether this was smart or lazy design on the part of the game designers, and whether extra-powerful cards like this are good or bad for the game/players, but have finally landed on the following side of the coin...


I like it. I think this is a clever concept by, and particularly for, the card designers. It frees them to introduce power creep, by also including an offset. Now instead of having to come up with new weird and wonderful mechanics in an effort to keep things fresh, they can basically go back and reproduce any card in a more powerful and/or cheaper form with the prized keyword. This is pretty much what they've done tweaking Wildfire Assault in to the new-and-improved Wildfire Assault 2.0: The Aftermath. There's a huge existing card pool for them to draw on, to produce more 'A Game of Thrones 2.0' cards like this, which is good for the designers and ultimately good for us I feel, because it strengthens what we already have (as opposed to taking the game in wacky new directions). I also think that, by releasing similar (albeit more powerful) cards in 2.0 prized versions, this will allow players to create more consistent decks - able to run 6 cards with much the same effect (2 similar cards in 3x copies), instead of just one set of 3; or 2 cards for plots (e.g. running both Wildfire Assault and The Aftermath), instead of just 1. Not to forget, this will be good for FFG too, as it'll keep us buying packs, because we're going to see these beefed-up 2.0 cards and won't be able to resist wanting them!

Edited by jasonconlon, 06 November 2013 - 08:53 AM.

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#8 SirRule

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Posted 06 November 2013 - 11:41 AM

What worries me is the amount of 'Un-Nedly' decks that will be showing up with that new agenda.

... yep, I'm one of those players. Sorry :P



#9 divinityofnumber

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Posted 06 November 2013 - 02:01 PM

I think that the prized keyword has great potential also. Like you said, it lets them address power creep, and it looks like it will lead to less cards being restricted or banned. 

 

I like the potential for abuse...play some event first turn with prized, and then you actually have some power to steal on that first big power challenge...

 

As it is now, when someone goes first and does a power challenge against me first turn, I just let it through, given no other obvious awful consequences for having done so. That way, when I swing back, I can grab it back, netting 2 power instead of just one for unopposed. Purposely giving your opponent power sometimes has its benefits!


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#10 dcdennis

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Posted 07 November 2013 - 06:26 AM

I think that the prized keyword has great potential also. Like you said, it lets them address power creep, and it looks like it will lead to less cards being restricted or banned. 
 
I like the potential for abuse...play some event first turn with prized, and then you actually have some power to steal on that first big power challenge...
 
As it is now, when someone goes first and does a power challenge against me first turn, I just let it through, given no other obvious awful consequences for having done so. That way, when I swing back, I can grab it back, netting 2 power instead of just one for unopposed. Purposely giving your opponent power sometimes has its benefits!


I used to think that, til TMP, BlackSails, seductive promise...... Thinking any challenge is meaningless just because the claim won't affect you is a dangerous precedent to set for yourself.

#11 mdc273

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Posted 07 November 2013 - 11:27 AM

Str 4 power challenge on turn 1? Sure! Unopp..... NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! NOT MY CAVALRY FLANK!!!!!


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#12 stormwolf27

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Posted 07 November 2013 - 02:20 PM

I think that the prized keyword has great potential also. Like you said, it lets them address power creep, and it looks like it will lead to less cards being restricted or banned. 

 

I like the potential for abuse...play some event first turn with prized, and then you actually have some power to steal on that first big power challenge...

 

As it is now, when someone goes first and does a power challenge against me first turn, I just let it through, given no other obvious awful consequences for having done so. That way, when I swing back, I can grab it back, netting 2 power instead of just one for unopposed. Purposely giving your opponent power sometimes has its benefits!

don't forget, using an event or losing a character/location with the "prized" keyword gives your opponent x power, not you


Edited by stormwolf27, 07 November 2013 - 02:20 PM.

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#13 MarthWMaster

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Posted 07 November 2013 - 03:10 PM

What worries me is the amount of 'Un-Nedly' decks that will be showing up with that new agenda.

... yep, I'm one of those players. Sorry :P

I'm quite Nedly too, but I like "out-of-house" agendas because they give players a way to field more than one faction during Joust. One of the reasons I generally dislike Joust is because it's a binary conflict, which doesn't reflect the events in the books all that well IMO (not to mention that most other LCGs and CCGs are 1v1). But with agendas like Conquest, players can at least represent the inter-house allying that shapes those events, whether or not they're deliberately emulating them.



#14 SirRule

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Posted 08 November 2013 - 12:19 AM

Oh, I don't mind agendas being out of house at all! That gets a pass for me.  What worries me is the tourney player who goes, "with this new agenda I can finally make Arya Stark and Joffrey Baratheon team up like 2 back-to-back besties!".  The example is extreme perhaps but this is what the new agenda sort of promotes and _that's_ the part that worries me.

Keep in mind I am picking up the first pack that contains Tycho Nestoris.  

Don't think I won't go out-of-house though! I'll do it if it's nedly.  For ex: using the kill-power Quentyn Martell in my Targ deck to make good use of the 'Blood Magic Ritual'.   



#15 mdc273

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Posted 11 November 2013 - 12:22 PM

I think people lose a little bit of the vision of "alternate universe" that AGoT truly is. AGoT LCG isn't "Nedly" at all. It's almost impossible for it to be so just by the nature of the game. The game is more about the variability of the characters and how, under different circumstances, Joffrey and Arya COULD be "besties." There is no inherent reason that what happened in the book was the only viable course of events. Joffrey could've been raised differently and that whole sequence of events never happens. So I think giving more ability to mashup and be less restrictive is far more appropro for the AGoT LCG than trying to pidgeon hole every character into a given role.

 

I feel it'd be far more approrpiate for most characters to be playable in other factions with minimal difficulty unless there is some major underlying reason it wouldn't happen (like pre-Game of Thrones history). So the whole "faction penalty" thing has always irked me.



#16 Bomb

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Posted 11 November 2013 - 03:07 PM

I think people lose a little bit of the vision of "alternate universe" that AGoT truly is. Competitive AGoT LCG isn't "Nedly" at all.

 

There, I just fixed that for you.  :-)



#17 mdc273

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 03:06 PM

Nah, the card game in general isn't Nedly. Rhaegar is a card. Balerion the Black is a card. Balerion can be out when Tommen is out. Not that Nedly.



#18 Bomb

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 12:16 PM

You can most certainly build a deck that has direct connections to the book.  I don't think that there is a single game that is considered to be realistic enough that it follows all the exact time lines and connections to it's story.  Otherwise we'd have all currently living characters with the text "cannot be killed" because they are still alive in the story.  We'd also have to go outside and bury dead character cards in a shallow grave in order for it to be truly Nedly/realistic.



#19 ktom

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 12:41 PM

Now instead of having to come up with new weird and wonderful mechanics in an effort to keep things fresh, they can basically go back and reproduce any card in a more powerful and/or cheaper form with the prized keyword. This is pretty much what they've done tweaking Wildfire Assault in to the new-and-improved Wildfire Assault 2.0: The Aftermath

 

I think the "well" they are more likely to be going to is out-of-print CCG cards that are too powerful for the LCG environment. In fact, The Aftermath is more like the CCG plot card Winter Storm - updated for a post-Shadows environment. The spoiled Catelyn is a essentially the Winter Edition Catelyn. Heck, Wheels Within Wheels is a card from the Westeros edition (the very first CCG set) that was too powerful for the CCG environment!

 

"Prized" actually reminds me of what they tried to do with the "Doomed" mechanic as a balance for considerable power-creep (although I think it will be more successful since you cannot ignore the consequences of putting a crap-load of Prized cards in your deck). Since Wheels is one of the cards they are using Prized to bring back, I'm going to be very interested to see what other CCG monsters end up with an LCG/Prized make-over.

 

I think it's going to be a good mechanic, affecting both deck building and in-game decisions. It has a good chance of being a reasonable balance - so long as they don't go nuts with what they use it to balance.


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#20 bloodycelt

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 01:18 AM

The only way they'll bring back Prince's Loyalist and have it balanced is to make it house stark only.






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