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Are dwarves better with the expansion?


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#1 SolennelBern

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:58 AM

Hey all! I got the game in french (Edge) and i'm waiting for the expansion to hit stores.  I played some games with the Dwarves and I agree with the general concensus that they need more punch.

 

Are they better with the expansion?



#2 Campaigner

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:41 PM

According to this analys, they seem WORSE than ever before!

 

 

I completely disagree and think they are (in the original game) shared best race together with the Wood Elves.

 

My brother who I have taught the game, won his second game and BOTH times with Dwarves!!   Can't BELIEVE I lost with Orks!! >_<



#3 Indalecio

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 01:49 AM

Sudden Death introduces 3 teams, two of them (Dark Elves, Undead) are a million times better than Dwarves, while the last one (Vampires) performs too randomly to allow a comparison. The extra toughness on downed Dwarves helps against the three new teams, but everything else is lacking as in the original game. 

 

Note that the expansion does not introduce any new content for the original teams aside from a few more staff upgrades which are not particularly relevant for Dwarves.

 

I think Dwarves perform "best" in duels (1 vs 1). With 4+ players around the table we´ve always seen them way behind every other team. We select our teams randomly so we´ve had equal amount of games with them than any other team, with player skill disparity. We´ve played something like 40 games already, maybe 15+ with the expansion, granted that was with at least 4 players (again, if you´re only playing duels then it does change a few things). Dwarves have never been in the top 3.

 

I respect the fact their performance may vary from metagame to metagame (in regards to the above post) but I am absolutely shocked somebody would rate Dwarves better than Humans. You need to play one game with Humans to realize that.


Edited by Indalecio, 09 October 2013 - 01:54 AM.


#4 Campaigner

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Posted 03 November 2013 - 07:43 AM

I learned how to play Humans just a month ago but haven't gotten them yet (we select teams randomly as well).

 

My brother gotted Humans against my Orcs and he have NEVER been so COMPLETELY defeated as that one game.

End score was 81 to his 21. Needless to say, he thinks the Humans are absolute crap.

 

Then again, he doesn't know how they work (he didn't have the correct teamupgrades) and still doesn't get some things (like how Freebooters work and various skills) so if I don't tell him that one of his character has dodge, then he doesn't tell me to reroll  ^_^

 

 

 

I also played my very first game as humans in a 4player game and lost. Didn't know anything else than how the game worked back then.



#5 Indalecio

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 04:51 AM

Well, there is a large part of luck in this game so I´m not saying the best teams always play out at their expected power level, and I won't be saying either they can't be defeated by lower tier teams. The game wouldn't be interesting at all if that was the case, lol. Also, 1vs1 games is a huge factor in the equation because some teams are much better in that format than in a larger free for all games.  And of course, if you also forget to apply the skills of the players you commit then it sorts of changes everything, I mean, you can't compare teams performance if you don't play them as they should be played :)

 

But generally speaking, after playing plenty of games with all the teams, some teams do end up with a much higher win ratio than others regardless of who pilots them, and Humans is one of them. Playing a couple of games with them and losing is not really a proof that they are weaker. You´re welcome to play more games and let us know about how you feel about the teams, there is another thread in this forum where we discuss about teams performances and comparison. You might be interested.


Edited by Indalecio, 09 January 2014 - 04:52 AM.


#6 DarkLoic

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 06:52 AM

Hey all! I got the game in french (Edge) and i'm waiting for the expansion to hit stores.  I played some games with the Dwarves and I agree with the general concensus that they need more punch.

 

Are they better with the expansion?

 

In my opinion, they are neither better, nor worse.



#7 Prepare for War

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 10:55 AM

According to this analys, they seem WORSE than ever before!

 

 

I completely disagree and think they are (in the original game) shared best race together with the Wood Elves.

 

My brother who I have taught the game, won his second game and BOTH times with Dwarves!!   Can't BELIEVE I lost with Orks!! >_<

 

Appreciate being linked: as I said in the analysis, there's a lot of subjectivity in the assessment.

 

A few things I find that makes dwarves weaker:

 

- They have a lot of Guard, but noone they need to guard, except maybe each other when they're downed.

- They can't handle being Passed against.

- They don't generate fans especially well.

- They don't sprint well, so you have to play a lot of linemen.

 

Having said that, in a 1:1 match up against orcs, they're probably at their strongest, as the orcs don't play the ball much, but instead just try and wear you down with blocks, which is what dwarves are best against.

 

As to the opening question, I think dwarves are relatively worse with the expansion in, as more block-resilient teams entered the fray. In general, I think blocking teams from the original got marginally weaker with the expansion in (thanks to Undead regeneration, downed skills, etc.) while passing teams got marginally stronger (thanks to enchanted balls).






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