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System redo. What to keep/lose?


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#1 Adeptus Ineptus

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:08 PM

Let's get this all in one place for them.

I say keep hit point free wounds and acton points.


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#2 Tom Cruise

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:09 PM

I'd love to see both kept, but if the intent is full backwards compatibility, they're likely to get axed. 


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#3 GauntZero

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:14 PM

Let's get this all in one place for them.

I say keep hit point free wounds and acton points.

+1

 

And the new fatigue system.


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#4 dholda

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:18 PM

Let's get this all in one place for them.
I say keep hit point free wounds and acton points.

+1
 
And the new fatigue system.
+1
Reduced skills
Fate triggered special abilities
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#5 GauntZero

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:21 PM

 

 

Let's get this all in one place for them.
I say keep hit point free wounds and acton points.

+1
 
And the new fatigue system.
+1
Reduced skills
Fate triggered special abilities

 

 

Yes ! Reduced skills also !

 

Also keep the RoF in general; its combined with AP much better than the old auto-semiauto system.


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#6 Nimsim

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:24 PM

I've sent an email asking about what is being taken out and what they'd like to see further feedback on. Ill post the reply when I get it.

#7 Adeptus Ineptus

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:27 PM

I'd love to see both kept, but if the intent is full backwards compatibility, they're likely to get axed. 

I've posted this before but if you need a hit point free wound system

 

If damage is more than armor + TB add 1 fatigue (if fatigue is grater than 1/2 TB role on chart.)
If damage is more than armor + (2 times TB) role on crit chart and add 1 fatigue.
If damage is more than armor + (3 times TB) limb hit is out of use till treated and add 1 fatigue.
If damage is more than armor + (4 times TB) limb hit is gone and add 2 fatigue.
 
Limb in this context includes head and body. Treat arms, legs and head as having 1/2 TB. Spending a fate point can drop damage down one level. If DH2 isn't using the name Sound Contrition each level of that be used to drop damage down one level aswell.
I haven't fixed it up so feel free to rip it apart to make it work.

I also would like something like a free magic system for psychic powers.



#8 Jaedar

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:36 PM

Drop the talent trees.

 

Keep the AP system, find a better way to handle wounds.

Remove the fate point abilities, they're mostly really boring 'automatically succeeed' type things anyway.


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#9 GauntZero

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:44 PM

Yes, Talent trees can be sacrificed for Tiers - that doesnt hurt much.

But the AP system was a real tactical innovation. To go back to the clumsy half and full action system is just a step back again.

What is a "half" action anyway ?

Edited by GauntZero, 17 September 2013 - 12:44 PM.

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#10 TorogTarkdacil812

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 12:55 PM

Scrap the talent trees, they are awful. Scrap characteristic and skill advancement tables.

 

Keep the refined skills and their usage with multiple characteristics.


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#11 Elior

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 01:04 PM

I do like the AP system. I hope they keep it.


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#12 Kaihlik

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 01:40 PM

Guys, there is literally no way of keeping AP and doing backwards compatibility. It isn't happening. Honestly the AP system as written was a terrible mess of badly clashing mechanics and I am glad to see the back of it. ROF linked with AP in the way it was was horribly broken something that the Eviscerator proved quite nicely. In addition the damage system was problematic at best when considering larger enemies which the beta had avoided. Some of the ideas were ok but execution was so bad that it required a complete rewrite of the whole combat system in order to make it work well, something that FFG obviously realised.

Edited by Kaihlik, 17 September 2013 - 02:17 PM.


#13 Adeptus Ineptus

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 01:50 PM

2 APs is a half action, 3 is a whole, 4 for anything that would stop you defending?



#14 PhilOfCalth

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 02:37 PM

No previous system was fully backwards compatible. If everyone in the community wants AP, why shouldn't they give us AP. Heck, we all knew it was going to be AP based when we bought it, and we bought it anyway. Opinions differ on how useful it is, but the fact that we all bought the book knowing that is enough to tell me that it's well enough liked to be just scrapped. Adding to that, it's not hard to convert any existing system to having AP, considering all characters get 4 ap.

 

Saying that I personally can take it or leave it, so it won't make my list. That's not to say I don't think it should be kept, just that I'd be happy enough without it.

 

 

So my stuff to keep:

 - Hit points free system (although the one we have needs refining down to something that fits on a GM screen)

 - Reduced Skills

 - Plenty of "GM Decides" rules

 - Challenge rating of NPCs

 

Throw out:

 - Talent trees

 - Most of the armory (keep ap based rate of fire)


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#15 Jaedar

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 02:40 PM

Oh also, redo the forbidden lore stuff. It's obscene that Flores cost the same for all characters(since you need the specialization) and also that it scales off of willpower and gives corruption points when you fail.

 

Keep AP, but just like in the other w40k roleplaying systems, include a section about converting between lines, and here include rules for how to switch between AP and full/half actions.

 

Oh and add back some of the removed skills and talents. I want my binary chatter and search skills.



#16 Naviward

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 03:32 PM

Same as a lot of people, keeping the AP and wound system would be great.

 

I liked the way lores were handled with the specialist talent covering a range of uses. 

 

They've already said so, but I'm glad they're keeping the character creation stuff, as that was really flexible.


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#17 Elior

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 03:54 PM

I just don't see what made FFG go back to the compatibility thing. I think there was plenty of support for the AP system to keep it. I don't there there was much outcry to abandon it.


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#18 H.B.M.C.

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 04:08 PM

I just hope that along with the re-write to the combat and armoury systems they re-jig the vehicle section to match with Only War. It would be nice to have the two systems match up.

Full Disclosure: Yes, I am bias in this regard as I wrote the OW vehicle rules.

BYE


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Matt Eustace. Contributing Author Credits: Church of the Damned, The Lathe Worlds, The Lathe Worlds - The Lost Dataslate, Only War Core Rulebook, Hammer of the Emperor, Shield of Humanity, Tome of Fate, Tome of Blood, Tome of Excess and Tome of Decay.

The views expressed in this post are my own. I do not speak for or on behalf of Fantasy Flight Games.


#19 Adeptus-B

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 04:35 PM

Keep the Beta character creation system- preferably modified to include some of the 'A' or 'B' options from DH1's character creation system.

 

Keep Influence- I do not want to go back to hoarding coins like this is D&D.


Edited by Adeptus-B, 17 September 2013 - 04:38 PM.


#20 LuciusT

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 05:00 PM

Things I would like to see in the systems re-do:

 

Keep the Beta character creation with the following changes: 1) add Imperial World to Homeworlds, 2) move Highborn to Backgrounds, 3) add a "Citizen" background to cover folks who aren't Adeptus and aren't Outcasts... basically someone who rose out of the rank and file of humanity.

 

Ditch the Beta combat, wounds and armory system, though I would be willing to keep the AP system if they simplified it to 2 action points per turn. What is presently a "Half Action" costs 1 AP, a "Full Action" costs 2 AP. I think that could work and would be clearer than the Half Action, Full Action nomenclature.

 

Keep the Influence, Subtly and Social Interaction rules.

 

I think that would be a good direction to go in.


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