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#21 Mastigos

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 07:52 AM

Ok, to make things easier. Everyone who wants to contribute to Ordo Xenos sourcebook, please send me a PM, it will be easier for me to get the band together.



#22 Adeptus-B

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 11:18 AM

Guys, just a question...

 

What is the attraction of a Ordo Xenos book for DH? As I see it, the Calixus sector is pretty much established and most xenos empires were "genocided™" by the Imperium. So any sentinent xenos left would be either very insignificant, raiders of some kind or a hidden xenos pocket empire with little contact with the rest of the sector. Or am I missing something?

 

I think the core appeal of an Ordo Xenos sourcebook is basic fairness. GMs are expected to choose either Hereticus, Malleus, or Xenos as the basis for a DH campaign. Two of those have a huge amount of support material- the third has very little.

 

Also, while it's true that the 'xeno threat' has been beaten down to the point that their military conquest of the Sector is no longer an option, that just puts them on the same basic footing as heretic cults, doesn't it...? I think the remnants of native xeno species, teetering on the brink of extinction and desperate for revenge against the Imperium, can be as interesting as any adversary in Disciples of the Dark Gods...


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#23 ranoncles

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 02:15 PM

Considering the views on the Ordo Xenos book, I think the focus should be on the Yu'vath and their client races. Remnants, artifacts, maybe even a few survivors?

 

Which would mean we'd have to work out a backstory. My own, admittedly rather vague, backstory was that the Yu'vath arose during the waning years of the war in heaven. They witnessed wholesale destruction and vowed to find the strength to survive in a harsh, hostile universe. And thus they discovered the warp and how it could be manipulated, hence the many artifacts powered by the warp (think a race of sorcerers/psykers).

 

As a species, they were quite limited in numbers so they sought to employ client races to provide slaves and warriors, much like the Old Ones had done before them. Physically weak but very intelligent, the Yu'vath discovered through trial & error that primitive races could be mastered by providing them with warp infused 'jewelry'. As the primitives wore these 'gifts from the gods', they slowly fell under the corrupting influence of the warp and became susceptible to the influence of the Yu'vath who they would eventually worship as living gods.

 

Living in their towers, each thus mastered huge numbers of slaves, ready to defend them from a renewed war in heaven. Thus when the Crusade came, the Yu'vath were well placed to fight the might of the Imperium.

 

So why did they lose? Because their millenia of warp use had so warped their own bodies that they needed the 'souls' of hundreds of sentient beings each day to prolongue their lives (much like the Emperor...). And faced with steady attrition from fighting the Imperium and being killed to feed their own masters, the client races could not defeat the Angevin Crusade and thus the Yu'vath empire (in the calixus sector at least) came to an end.

 

So there you have it. My idea for the Yu'vath. I never got to deciding if they had indeed been wiped out or that more lived beyond the map....

 

I am sure others have much better background stories and look forward to reading them, maybe in the Ordo Xenos book?


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#24 Morangias

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 05:24 PM

Also, while it's true that the 'xeno threat' has been beaten down to the point that their military conquest of the Sector is no longer an option, that just puts them on the same basic footing as heretic cults, doesn't it...?

Yeah, that. No matter what adversaries one uses, Calixis Sector (and arguably Dark Heresy at all) is more suited to telling stories of less open threats.


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#25 Fgdsfg

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 12:29 AM

Guys, just a question...
 
What is the attraction of a Ordo Xenos book for DH? As I see it, the Calixus sector is pretty much established and most xenos empires were "genocided™" by the Imperium. So any sentinent xenos left would be either very insignificant, raiders of some kind or a hidden xenos pocket empire with little contact with the rest of the sector. Or am I missing something?


A sector that have not been Genocided™ is a sector more fitting for Only War or Rogue Trader, depending on circumstance. Sector Calixis is interesting because it is clearly Imperium Proper, yet there's cults and insurrections aplenty.

While certain xenos might be inappropriate (such as Orks, although not undoable - small burgeoning greenskin infestation in the underhives, anyone?), others are perfect material for the Inquisition and the Acolytes to deal with. Wayward genestealer cults, eldar mechanizations, those warp-based-brain-parasite-things, or various backdoor plans by raider races (Dark Eldar striking a deal with a terrorized and scared planetary governor, or a Rak'gol Abomination setting up a massive strategic raid from the inside, or the last of the Yu'Vath summoning daemons through mystic techno-sorcery on a Feral World).

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#26 Fgdsfg

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 02:22 AM

Apologies for the double-post, but apparently I'm retarded today.

Ok, to make things easier. Everyone who wants to contribute to Ordo Xenos sourcebook, please send me a PM, it will be easier for me to get the band together.


How do you intend to organize this? If you intend to set up some kind of workgroup or chat, I'd love to be part of it just to see how things progress and perhaps add some input. However, to avoid clutter, you might want to create a more restricted group of people that are all actively contributing, which would be entirely understandable.

Cheers, and I look forward to seeing whatever you come up with.

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These things are dumb and do not exist. This is non-negotiable and undebatable.


#27 Jargal

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 02:34 AM

"Calixis Sector Gazetteer" would be a wonderful addition to DH. I think we all have a a lot of GM developments (mine, to be honest, are in complete disorder :)) and if we can bring them together - that would be great.



#28 Adeptus-B

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Posted 30 August 2013 - 02:12 PM

... My own, admittedly rather vague, backstory was that the Yu'vath arose during the waning years of the war in heaven. They witnessed wholesale destruction and vowed to find the strength to survive in a harsh, hostile universe. And thus they discovered the warp and how it could be manipulated, hence the many artifacts powered by the warp (think a race of sorcerers/psykers).

 

That's a cool story, ranoncles, but aren't the Halo Artifacts supposed to predate the Yu'Vath? I could be wrong about that, but if not, I'd say the Yu'Vath built their empire on the ruins of the long-vanished civilization that created the Halo Devices. And who could that be...?

 


 

Ok, to make things easier. Everyone who wants to contribute to Ordo Xenos sourcebook, please send me a PM, it will be easier for me to get the band together.


How do you intend to organize this? If you intend to set up some kind of workgroup or chat, I'd love to be part of it just to see how things progress and perhaps add some input. However, to avoid clutter, you might want to create a more restricted group of people that are all actively contributing, which would be entirely understandable.

 

Hmm, I don't know, I think we should try for the maximum amount of input. I say just start a 'work in progress' thread and solicit as many contributions as possible, then separate the 'wheat' from the 'chaff' later, when we are ready to compile it all together.

 

(I haven't received a reply to my PM yet, btw...)

 

"Calixis Sector Gazetteer" would be a wonderful addition to DH. I think we all have a a lot of GM developments (mine, to be honest, are in complete disorder :)) and if we can bring them together - that would be great.

 

I've created a bunch of stuff for Calixis worlds, too- but it's all hand-written in spiral notebooks. I've been meaning to type it up into postable form, but I'm not sure when I'll get around to that...



#29 Fgdsfg

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Posted 31 August 2013 - 06:42 AM

[...]

(I haven't received a reply to my PM yet, btw...)

[...]


I.. umm.. was that directed at me? I haven't received any PM:s from you. I have exactly one message in my inbox - I haven't responded to it, true, but it wasn't from you. I'm so easily confused. D:

Edit: I now realize that it was probably aimed at Mastigos, who was part of the nested quotes.


Edited by Fgdsfg, 31 August 2013 - 06:44 AM.

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These things are dumb and do not exist. This is non-negotiable and undebatable.


#30 Mastigos

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 02:08 PM

Considering the views on the Ordo Xenos book, I think the focus should be on the Yu'vath and their client races. Remnants, artifacts, maybe even a few survivors?

 

I really like your story for the Yu'vath but we must remember that this is supposed to be book about the Ordo Xenos first and formost, while their dedicated enemies are very important and describing them is thing that needs to be done, we need to remember to put our focus on Alien Hunters.

 

 

How do you intend to organize this? If you intend to set up some kind of workgroup or chat, I'd love to be part of it just to see how things

progress and perhaps add some input. 

 

Here is how I would like to see it organized: create both chat on skype that will allow us fast discussions, deciding what to put inside the book, dividing work and chatting about the project. And I would like to set up some small private forums to post content, provide lengthy reviews and point out things that need to be reworked. I do not want to do it here on forums because it would be very inefficient for a group project. Posting things here and getting opinion is perfectly fine if someone posts things he's doing on his own. But discussions and lots of people seeing the project in work would just create unnecesary clutter that would slow things down. While my intent is not secrecy, it's after all project "whoever wants, joins" and everything will be published for free for everyone. I would just prefer to avoid been slowed down by people discussing about things posted, sending their ideas, demanding this, hating that. Etc.



#31 Cogniczar

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 02:59 PM

http://www.darkreign...w=unread#unread

 

I'm working on Recidivist's Handbook on Dark Reign. This link is basically my project log as I go about making drafts of this and that until it's complete. 

 

For Alien Hunters (Know Thine Enemy?), I'd be willing to work on Alternate Careers and Elite Advances, and even Cell Operatives. 


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#32 ranoncles

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:37 AM

 

Considering the views on the Ordo Xenos book, I think the focus should be on the Yu'vath and their client races. Remnants, artifacts, maybe even a few survivors?

 

I really like your story for the Yu'vath but we must remember that this is supposed to be book about the Ordo Xenos first and formost, while their dedicated enemies are very important and describing them is thing that needs to be done, we need to remember to put our focus on Alien Hunters.

----

 

 

 

Oops, didn't mean to suggest the book should be (exclusively) focused on the Yu'vath but rather that the Alien Hunters should mostly encounter their artifacts and surviving client races. So more information about them would would help tie the different (remaining) aliens and artifacts together, considering the Yu'vath were the dominant species in the sector before the coming of the Imperium.  

 

 



#33 Surak

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:25 AM

Hi All,

 

I've got a massive amount of material from my various DH campaigns over the years, alot of which never got used by my players as it was to cover alternate campaign arcs.

 

I am very willing to pitch in on this project in terms of writing, if whoever is co-ordinating could drop me a PM of what they would like me to look at and I'll go from there.

 

Regards

 

Surak


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#34 Adeptus-B

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 10:23 AM

Here is how I would like to see it organized: create both chat on skype that will allow us fast discussions, deciding what to put inside the book, dividing work and chatting about the project. And I would like to set up some small private forums to post content, provide lengthy reviews and point out things that need to be reworked. I do not want to do it here on forums because it would be very inefficient for a group project. Posting things here and getting opinion is perfectly fine if someone posts things he's doing on his own. But discussions and lots of people seeing the project in work would just create unnecesary clutter that would slow things down. While my intent is not secrecy, it's after all project "whoever wants, joins" and everything will be published for free for everyone. I would just prefer to avoid been slowed down by people discussing about things posted, sending their ideas, demanding this, hating that. Etc.

 

Okay. I'm not sure how often I'll be able to participate on Skype, though...

 

To get the ball rolling, here’s a quick summary of what I could find relating to the Calixis Ordo Xenos:

 

DARK HERESY RULEBOOK- p.272 contains a one-page summary of the Ordo Xenos, including a tantalizing reference to the use of alien allies by some radical Inquisitors.

 

THE INQUISITOR’S HANDBOOK- p.58 details the Calixian Xeno-Arcanist Alternate Rank, a specialist in xeno-lore.

 

CREATURES ANATHEMA- A smattering of Calixian xenos and xenobeasts, very much in need of expanding. The only sentient xenos native to Calixis presented here are the Enoulians (p.86); there are hints of some kind of Big Mystery behind their activities that should probably be explored…

 

THE RADICAL’S HANDBOOK- By far the most info relevant to the Ordo Xenos is in this book. Chapter VI (The Lure Of The Alien, starting on p.198) contains descriptions of several items of Xeno Technology, including some interesting references to various alien species (Xenarch, Scythian, Q’Orl), including some native to the Calixis Sector. There are also sections on Xeno Lore (mosty covering interacting with xenos) and some Xeno Sites.

Additionally, RH includes some xeno assets in the Resources section (the Kabal of the Crimson Woes p.134, The Cortax [“A rough alliance of roving alien mercenaries-“: this really needs to be expanded upon!] p.135, and the Axebiter Tribe p.136). Blasphemous Allies (p.140) deals with training xenobeasts, and there is a brief description of the Calixis-specific Ordo Xenos faction Xeno Hybris on p.128.

 

DISCIPLES OF THE DARK GODS- Chapter III: Xenos (p.70) has a lot of good info, including an overview of the Cold Trade (with a handful of xeno items, plus a reference to another local xeno species: the Fra’al), plus some factions (the Amaranthine Syndicate, the Beast House), xenos (Slaught, Cryptos), and details on Halo Devices (these really need more background detail, i.m.o.). Also, p.181 has more info on Xeno Hybris.

 

BOOK OF JUDGEMENT- P.37 features the Cold Trader Background Package.

 

DAEMONHUNTERS- The description of the Synapse Disruptor (p.68) contains this fascinating reference: “The Terlain Cluster, found trailing from the Hazeroth Abyss, has long been a hub of the Cold Trade”, plus a mention of “-reptilian-looking Vault-Keepers-“. This really needs to be explored- I’m picturing something like a Calixis version of William Burroughs’ ‘Interzone’…

 

The ROGUE TRADER game also has a fair amount of Calixian xenos information:

 

ROGUE TRADER RULEBOOK- The Armoury section contains a handful of xeno items, and an interesting reference to the extinct Crux (p.127).

 

INTO THE STORM- P.22 has Xenos Hunter and Xeno-Arcanist Background Packages. P.100 features the Xenographer Alternate Rank. There are also some xeno items in the Extended Armoury section; the Galthite Lacerators (p.125) hint at a new xeno race. ITS also includes rules for Sanctioned Xeno PCs (Orks and Kroot); I’m sure that whether or not something like this should be included in this project will be the subject of much debate…

 

EDGE OF THE ABYSS- Chapter III: Foes and Rivals features information on several xenos found in or near the Calixis Sector.

 

HOSTILE ACQUISITIONS- P.34 features the Cold Trade Broker Alternate Rank. There is also some xenogear included in the Tools of the Trade section.

 

KORONUS BESTIARY- Many xenos included in this book, and the most information anywhere on the Yu’Vath.

 

THE SOUL REAVER- This adventure (and it’s supplementary .pdf The Dark Kin) includes a great deal of information on Dark Eldar, including details on their Calixis-menacing base: the Nexus of Shadows.

 

______________

 

So, what do we need for an Ordo Xenos sourcebook? Here are my thoughts:

 

  • An overview of the factions and cabals within the Ordo Xenos, and a ‘Who’s Who’ of prominent figures within the Ordo. Also, information on the Ordo Xeno’s support of the settlement of the Koronus Expanse, and their work as ‘advisors’ to the Imperial Guard fighting the Ork Waaagh! on the Spinward Front.
  • More Background Packages and Alternate Ranks, naturally (I’m working on a Freed Thrall Background Package and a Xenoarchaeologist Alternate Rank).
  • An Armoury; possibly divided into 'Xeno Items' and xeno-fighting 'Counter-Measures'.
  • There’s already quite a bit of info on the Cold Trade, but I think a detailed example of a Cold Trade organization would be useful. And I would really like to see a 1d100 list of minor xeno artifacts (with no combat applications) that can be used to quickly flesh out a Cold Trade auction, wearhouse, or smuggler’s vessel.
  • Information on the Calixian Deathwatch, possibly with guidelines for including a Deathwatch Kill-Marine (Rites of Battle, p.123) in a team of Throne Agents. (I set my Deathwatch campaign in the Calixis Sector; here are a few details that I’ve come up with)
  • Lots more information on Calixian xenos- both those wiped out in the Angevin Crusade and those that are still active within the sector. I’ve already come up with my own versions of Hrud, Morgauth (RH p.200), and Verminthiculians (DHRB p.258)- see the ‘New Xenos’ link in my ‘signature’ at the bottom of this post- and I’m working on detailing the Draethri (RH p.201). Fra’al (DotDG p.73), Galthites (ItS p.125) and the extinct Crux (RTRB p.127) would be very good to have detailed, as well as the Xenarch (RH p.200) and Q’Orl (RH p.202)- these last two having write-ups in the Black Library book Xenology. And more information on the Slaught, including details of their conflict with the Storm Wardens on the planet Vigil.
  • More xeno sites within the sector (-why are some of the Calixis Sector’s ‘Forbidden Worlds’ forbidden…?).

 

That’s my ‘wish list’…



#35 Cogniczar

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 10:33 AM

Like I said before, I'm willing to do Alt Ranks and stuff like. A quick brian storm and I can figure this:

 

Careers

- Deathwatch Kill-Teams / Kill-Marine

- Sanctioned Xeno (Jokaero, Ork, Eldar?)

- Conservator (Imperial Archeologist)

 

Alternate Ranks

- Xenographer

- Xenocist (A Chirurgeon who specializes in expelling xeno taint from an infected individual.

 

 

 

 



#36 Mastigos

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 10:48 AM

@Adeptus-B, that is mighty fine work you have done. Your research is very good and immensely helpful. I completely agree with your wish list, to expand it however, in my opinion we really need to tackle the subject of Sanctioned Xenos. While that doesn't necessarily mean we have to create playable Eldar or any other race, the topic really needs to be taken into consideration. What really are Sanctioned Xenos? What rules govern them? How does xeno become Sanctioned? What mission it is sent on? How much trust (or rather distrust) it has to deal with? How Inquisitors in Calixis view Sanctioning of Xenos? 

 

We have to answer this question because the topic of Sanctioned Xenos is one of the most interesting thing mentioned in 40k books, but never really explained. 

 

Second thing - Saruthi and other Chaos xenos, Saruthi are race from Dan Abnett's Xenos book. Like you all probably know, they were a race corrupted by Chaos, did they have any influence on Calixis sector? Maybe there are some Saruthi artifacts or even enclaves? After all, Scarus neighbours with Calixis. This leads us to discussing the topic of Chaos corrupting other races than men. What does it do to orks? Are there Chaos Eldar (there were in the old fluff, do we bring them back?) Were Yu'vath just warp-dabblers or Chaos worshippers? 

 

Third thing - the Tyrant Star, Ordo Xenos' approach to it, theories and operations concerning it. What OX Inquisitor's think of this phenomenon? How they investigate it? What race do they blame for it?

 

Fourth thing - Ordo Xenos holdings, description of Ordo Malleus bases was in my humble opinion one of the best things in Daemon Hunters, we should devote some pages to secret Ordo Xenos labs, bestiaries, xeno artifact repositories.

 

Also concerning Cold Trade - what are punishments for it? Of course, selling alien weapons deserves probably a death sentence but what punishment can be given to a noble who bought an alien sculpture, a really truly innocent sculpture that just happenes to not be mind corrupting machine, xeno atom bomb or portal to the warp?



#37 Cogniczar

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 04:17 PM

Third thing - the Tyrant Star, Ordo Xenos' approach to it, theories and operations concerning it. What OX Inquisitor's think of this phenomenon? How they investigate it? What race do they blame for it?

 

Timelords. Always blame the Timelords.



#38 Adeptus-B

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 04:26 PM

Timelords. Always blame the Timelords.

 

I was wondering why everyone in the future is British...



#39 Morangias

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Posted 03 September 2013 - 02:29 AM

 

Timelords. Always blame the Timelords.

 

I was wondering why everyone in the future is British...

I can't find it right now, but in the ancient times of Rogue Trader (as in, TT first edition, not the RPG) there was a sample scenario that implied the presence of The Doctor in the 40k universe. At about the same time, GW also held the license for producing Dr Who miniatures for a brief time.


There is no truth in flesh, only betrayal.

There is no strenght in flesh, only weakness.
There is no constancy in flesh, only decay.
There is no certainty in flesh but death.


#40 Adeptus-B

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Posted 03 September 2013 - 03:08 PM

I can't find it right now, but in the ancient times of Rogue Trader (as in, TT first edition, not the RPG) there was a sample scenario that implied the presence of The Doctor in the 40k universe. At about the same time, GW also held the license for producing Dr Who miniatures for a brief time.

 

And here I thought that the 40Kverse was Star Trek's 'Mirror Universe' thirty-something-thousand years in the future...






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