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Qusetion on attacking burning zones with units


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#1 Gelth

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 09:05 AM

So as the title says attacking a burning zone with units.  Now mainly I mean battlefield.  I am a new player and recently had a game where I had the fortune to burn down my opponents battlefield early in the game.  Now it seemed I was punished for this since 1. I couldn't target her units in that zone to weaken them so they couldn't romp around as they wanted. 2. until she had sufficient tough units in Kingdom and Quest to where in that game I could not attack unless I leave myself extremely open at that time.  So as it turned out I attacked the Kingdom with regular units (and I do understand that their are cards to force defenders and a few that remove units however that is dependent on deck setup and the luck of the draw- I had no such cards atm for several turns as I have the core set and limited to those kinda things and where they may land)and she simply did not defend and the damage just disappears, this is how we read the rule.

 

I am wondering why this is, its leaves more up to luck than strategy punishing a player for taking advantage of an opportunity and what should be a tactically good one.  Even with battlefield burning I do not understand how when attacking it the defender can just do nothing with the damage if they decide not to defend.  They take no damage to units and none to another capital area not even an increase in cost for placing units within battlefield.  With the other zones I understand since its resources and card draws.  But to be unable to try and intercept their army on the field of battle instead of letting them run rampant seems to be one more limiting factor to this game which once again starts to remove more strategy options in favor of luck.  I capitalized on a weakness and then paid for it since her army was free to bob and weave as it where however she liked striking only weak points and allowing me no wiggle room what so ever so now the game becomes more of a formula of attack kingdom first since you want them burning cards and you don't want their armies just doing whatever they want or you have to buy packs and expansions to try and build a counter deck that will still be built on luck and very little strategy. 

 

Am I wrong on the rule in this case if so then good if not I will be selling a core set as both of us have no interest at that point.



#2 Virgo

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 09:27 AM

1 I couldn't target her units in that zone to weaken them so they couldn't romp around as they wanted.
 
You could still do whatever you want to units in a burnt zone. Yes, your opponent won't block with units once a zone is burnt, but this goes true for every zone. Burning a battlefiels is actually a good idea very early in the game, because in first turns players usually place units in quest/kingodm zones leaving battlefield open (although if you decide to attact quest/kingdom and your opponent defends with units he or she looses power these units provide in that zone). Furthermore if battlefiled burns early when the time comes for opponent to attack his units played into battlefield will provide him with only an attack option, no use in defending with them while the zone is already burnt and battlefiels is a zone where usually most units are played into. Also there are a lot of ways of killing units besides combat.
 
2. until she had sufficient tough units in Kingdom and Quest to where in that game I could not attack unless I leave myself extremely open at that time. 

 

To me it seems you tried to rush her, she sacrficed one zone, but gained enough economic edge where you couldn't burn any of her other zones. If you play rush you have to quick enough to burn two zones before enemy can lock you, also if that was the case you could burn her kingdom/quest early and then force her to defend battlefiels so she couldn't play units into kingdom/quest comfortably.

 

If you are playing with only one core set then yes, some cards are 1x and it may be difficult to punish units. You can put more power into your quest zone to get faster to the cards that you need or play more defensivly as she did. As far as I understand you have 1 core set, yes? It would be good to know what races exactly you two played.

 


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#3 Gelth

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 02:31 PM

You could still do whatever you want to units in a burnt zone. Yes, your opponent won't block with units once a zone is burnt, but this goes true for every zone. Burning a battlefiels is actually a good idea very early in the game, because in first turns players usually place units in quest/kingodm zones leaving battlefield open (although if you decide to attact quest/kingdom and your opponent defends with units he or she looses power these units provide in that zone). Furthermore if battlefiled burns early when the time comes for opponent to attack his units played into battlefield will provide him with only an attack option, no use in defending with them while the zone is already burnt and battlefiels is a zone where usually most units are played into. Also there are a lot of ways of killing units besides combat.

 

still do whatever I wanted to the zone. Battlefield only offers the ability to attack so no I cant.  and actually attacking battlefield early is a bad decision if attacking early you will want to attack another zone so you have the ability to weaken their army should you need to. As a strategy game that limits strategy we both have chosen to sell this game but thank you for making sure I was on the right path.

 

also if that was the case you could burn her kingdom/quest early and then force her to defend battlefiels so she couldn't play units into kingdom/quest comfortably.

 

this becomes the strategy to use while kingdom is first due to limiting resources their is no reason to attack any other zone first even if she had units early in kingdom going here is still the first move of any game if you rush or not.  ruling out two other zones.  Knowing that if battle burns you cant do anything about their units for the most part so they can do what they want to who they want. and also that kingdom will actually hold a fair number of units as well limiting resources if first and most important again limiting strategy.  being able to go after the battlefields units after it burns is akin to running down an army or finding their camping spot.  Without this option this game is pointless sorry but the strategy part just became a formula and a simple one at that.



#4 Virgo

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 03:32 PM

You only see the game from a perspective of an owner of a single Core Set and you think that units are meant to be killed while exchanging blows during combat. That often happens, but is not the core rule of this game. You think that kingdom zone is the most imprortant while actually it is the quest zone, you can play cards if you have only 3 resources (even if it will be 1 or 2 cards a turn), but you can't play without cards on your hand. You think as a beginner, expand your kingdoms/quest zones, draw many cards and resources (six to ten) and then go for ofensive while experienced players tend to play with 3-4 card draws and for many races it is enough to have 4 power in their kingdom.

 

The game isn't flawed (at least not in this matter), you simple don't like the fact that it doesn't play the way you want it to.


Edited by Virgo, 21 August 2013 - 03:33 PM.


#5 c2h4n

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 03:47 AM

when we (my wife and me) got there core set there were only rules problems. we both have different points of view jn the tactics - i prefer rush or heavy hitting, she likes control and domination.

 

as I see the situation, Gelth and his girl are not skilled enough in abstract planning or tactics. or they just both didn't get the point of game. I totally agree with Virgo-pal – that's obvious lack of experience here.


Till Chaos will tear us apart.


#6 Katsuyori

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:18 AM

You only see the game from a perspective of an owner of a single Core Set and you think that units are meant to be killed while exchanging blows during combat. That often happens, but is not the core rule of this game. You think that kingdom zone is the most imprortant while actually it is the quest zone, you can play cards if you have only 3 resources (even if it will be 1 or 2 cards a turn), but you can't play without cards on your hand. You think as a beginner, expand your kingdoms/quest zones, draw many cards and resources (six to ten) and then go for ofensive while experienced players tend to play with 3-4 card draws and for many races it is enough to have 4 power in their kingdom.

You just sounded like Kongming lecturing some other character (from the chinese Three Kingdoms classic novel) about tactics. Great :)






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