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What am I doing wrong with my Imperial squads?


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#1 andersb25

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Posted 17 June 2013 - 12:43 AM

I am continous losing with my Imperial ships and need som tips on what to do. I try to keep the ships toghether in a tight squad to get the all the benefits that the ships gives eachother withing range 1-2 but it only takes 2-3 rounds before they are forced to split up becuase one of them collides with a rebels ship and are moved backwards or becasue of some other reason. And after that I have it VERY difficult to manouver them toghether again. Should I ignore the collisions I can avoid and prioritize that my ships will continue flying toghether?

I finf that the biggest advantage the rebel has againt me are the shields they have. I often hit them slightly more then they hit me during a game but with the shields and hull they simply dont get down (especially the Falcon).

I have tried a large variety of ships and pilots (and lists that are posted here) with more or less the same outcome so the problem is how I play, not chosing bad squads.

Any general suggestions?



#2 jetsetter

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Posted 17 June 2013 - 01:26 AM

Try breaking you squad up into small groups (3-4), get them flying and shooting together, use barrel rolls and boost (if available) to stay out of firing arcs (not much you can do about that against the falcon).  Don't forget your actions and pilot abilities!!  Play games with the rebels, knowing the dials of your opponents ships is invaluable.

asteroids or ships will collide with your swarm, how you recover after collisions has a great effect on the following couple of rounds. 



#3 DoubleNot7

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Posted 17 June 2013 - 01:56 AM

Split your force into groups as Jetsetter suggested.  Also sounds like you need some practice on choosing/rwacting to maneuvers.


Enimo Et Fide


#4 andersb25

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Posted 17 June 2013 - 02:01 AM

Thanks for the suggestions. My squad are 2-3 ships large. I do try to use the barrel roll and boost but somehow they do not tend to do any difference (there are still line of sight). I think it is the movement where I make my mistakes, there are turns where I end up not being able to shoot because the enemy has flown out of line of sight).



#5 RedWilde

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Posted 17 June 2013 - 03:17 AM

Use some Academy Pilots and use them to jam up the Rebels movement and force them to crash.  

I don't pack my swarms in too tight.  I prefer a looser gaggle with ships firing at ranges 1, 2, and 3; that's gives a very good set up for the following turns.

Concentrate your fire, but come in from a couple of different angles of approach onto your target.  Google "Thatch Weave".

Concentrate your fire on one select target at a time.  Give up close range shots on some possible targets if you can get more concentrated fire on another. 2-3 turns of concentrated fire will take down a Falcon; you must do this early in the game before you've taken to many losses to your fire base.  Concentrated fire will splat an X-Wing or Y-Wing right quick. 



#6 vyrago

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 12:57 PM

I was almost starting to believe the hype about the game being 'tough' for Imperials to win.  I made this list today and wiped my Rebel opponent off the board with them!  I suffered no losses, although Krassis had merely 1 hull point left. 

===============
The Aristocrats
===============

100 points

Pilots
------

Krassis Trelix (43)
Firespray-31 (36), Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

Dark Curse (16)

Mauler Mithel (19)
TIE Fighter (17), Expert Handling (2)

Howlrunner (22)
TIE Fighter (18), Determination (1), Stealth Device (3)

------



#7 aadh

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 01:55 PM

I gave "The Aristocrats" a thumbs-up on voidstate. I look forward to trying it out.


Rebel— 12 X-Wing | 10 Y-Wing | 6 A-Wing | 6 B-Wing | 2 YT-1300 | 3 HWK-290 | 2 GR-75 | 1 CR-90 | 3 Z-95 | 3 E-Wing

Imperial— 18 TIE/ln | 18 TIE/in | 8 TIE/sa | 4 TIE/x1 | 3 Firespray-31 | 2 Lambda | 3 TIE Defender | 3 TIE Phantom


#8 sozin

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 07:54 AM

Go read piqsid's maneuver articles!  http://boardgamegeek...t_Analysis.pdf 


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#9 Norsehound

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 09:08 AM

The Empire's biggest strength are their greater numbers. Invdivitual fighters at 3 hull strength just isn't enough to stand toe-to-toe with the Rebel X-Wing, even with 3 agility. The standard ratio for TIEs to X-Wings is 2:1.

You'll have to learn how to manuver with them, but I suggest flying not as many ace pilots and putting a few generics in your lists. If the quality of your attacks is not as high as you like, try increasing the number of attacks. Most ships will be shooting at 2 in the Empire… try to do as many of those shots as you can.


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#10 Violator911

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 10:10 AM

I find this funny cause i have the same problem.. rebels kick my ars everytime. Heres what i was telling a guy.. i keep a notebook of my groups. continuesly evolving and perfecting my fleet. as they have evolved i do get better. i played a game last night and let a friend that i was teaching how to play run my last 100pt team. and he kicked my ars big time. heres what he had

 

Soon ti (push the limit)

Howl runner (stealth device)

Back Stabber (stealth device)

Academy Pilot

Alpha Squad Pilot

Now i got another idea and im gonna evolve it again.. so we will see how it goes :)



#11 Syleh Forge

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 03:03 PM

It sounds like it's less about the formations, or the squads you choose, or even (sometimes i'd assume) the actions you take, but it's the flying that will make the difference.  You can't really fly imps like the rebels.  Rebels just charge right in, take a couple on their shields and slaughter whoever they can attack…with imps, you gotta have flankers, you gotta take koiogans (sp?) you have to make use of 1 hard rights (when you can)…RedWilde's advice is excellent.  Approach from seperate angles, then they have to choose which side to shoot, and your other side can get on their tail.

Also, if you have an expensive guy (vader/firespray/soontir) try to pack at least oh…3 generics or so in too.  Imperials need around 50% more ships (in most cases) to do well against rebels.  (i.e. rebs have 4 imps need 6).  Exceptions to this are 3 firesprays, or something like that…but don't use many glass cannons.  Interceptors are great, but they need a Stealth Device cause they're a top target.  

Good luck my friend, i hope you can start crushing the Rebel scum.


8 X-wings, 7 A-wings, 4 Y-wings, 2 YT-1300, 4 B-wings,  2HWK-290, 3 E-wings, 3 Z-95's, 1 Transport, 1 CR-90

14 Tie Fighters, 13 Interceptors, 3 Advanced, 4 Firesprays, 4 Bombers, 3 Defenders, 3 Phantoms, 1 Lambda


#12 andersb25

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 08:14 PM

Great ideas from everyone. I will propably to a lot better next game. I have not focused as much as needed on movement I understand.



#13 Norsehound

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 11:44 PM

Something to add to Syleh's points… the Empire doesn't really miss much with the reverse-turns. Sure a stress action means you can't do a red manuver but really the only thing you're missing out on when flying TIEs is a focus token. If you're packing 6-8 TIE fighters, focus tokens are a trivial advantage when you have numbers and superior manuverability on your side. If you have to choose between a red manuver to get closer to the enemy and a safer route with a guranteed token, I'd take the red manuver if you're flying in numbers. Your objective is to position your ships as best as you can and get as many shots off at a single target as possible.

The only exception to the above is if you think you can do a move and a barrel roll to put you in an ideal position to hit a Rebel ship at close range (or escape being shot at). This is an iffy call, because it requires some practice to gauge where your fighters go with templates. But it's a skill worth aquiring in this game… one way to do it is to stage battles against yourself between TIE fighters and whatever other rebel craft you wish to practice against. Flying that many fighters around so many asteroids would help you learn the templates quick enough.



#14 vyrago

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 05:33 AM

Some good points.  Need to emphasise that you focus your fire on a single target and kill it.  Go for a high value target and kill it in 1 or 2 turns.  The longer the game goes on, the more favorable the odds for a rebel player.  If your opponent has Biggs, kill him first!  He may not seem like a threat, but he will affect your ability to fire at others later with his special rule, so just take him out then move on to the next target.  A good indication of how well you've maneuvered is at the end of the game, if you've lost and there are 2 or 3 damaged Rebel ships left then you've failed.  Shoot everybody at a single target until its dead!  Use Barrel Rolls!  Sometimes a good barrel roll is better than focus or evade since it may get you out of someone's arc while still having a target.  Get close range shots!  you need those extra dice to hammer through those shields.  The Imperial player will benefit from being aggressive and getting kills early.  The rebel player will seek to save his ships, he will almost always have fewer numbers!  Go for 'overmatches' when possible.  Low agility ships like Y-wings and the Falcon are easy to hit.  at close range, you'll be rolling 3 or 4 attack dice against their 1 defense.  Remember the shooting order!  your elite pilots will likely be hammering down shields and removing focus tokens from targets while your Academy pilots (and the like) will be delivering the kill.  






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