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Close Combat and obscured miniatures


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#1 felkor

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 03:07 PM

If it's a close combat attack, do you still follow the rules for determining the order that miniatures be removed - i.e., miniatures that are not obscured get removed before miniatures that are obscured.

I think the rules should be the same as ranged attacks and can't find anything that says otherwise, but just wanted to be sure.



#2 536RodneySmith

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:08 AM

Heh. I just came over here to check too :)

I started a similar thread on BGG to see what kind of feedback we could get: http://boardgamegeek...curity-priority

For those reading this, my interpretation was that since Close Combat negates the effects of Cover, obscurity was no longer checked, and therefore when assigning damage you don't follow any priority like you do in ranged combat - instead, the defending player is free to assign damage to any model since none are obscured.

Will be interesting to see what people say, since I can see where Felkor is coming from, but have come to a different conclusion still.

I suppose I relate it to the other ways related rules work.  For example, you only need to be within range of one model in a unit in order to contribute close combat dice to the attack, however, when assigning damage, the defender can remove models from the unit that are actually more than 3 inches away from any of the attacking models.  My understanding of this, was that the players are to assume that the models are actually in a constant state of motion, and therefore while in close combat, they are "figurtively" moving around.

As shown here:   at 18 minutes and 30 seconds in.

So while you might think of some of the models as being obscured, in Close Combat, all of the models are moving around to attack one another, and therefore, can't duck down behind barrels or trees, as all the models are effectively "in the cover" as they actively move about to attack the target unit.

As I say though, it's an interesting question and I can certainly see how I could have rationalized this incorrectly.



#3 felkor

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 02:39 AM

Rodney, I think your rationaliation is completely reasonable.  I don't see it in the rules though.  That said, there have been other things that they have FAQed where the rules as strictly written weren't what they intended, so who knows what they'll say.

I sent a rules question in, so FFG should respond at some point with the official answer.  I'm pretty good with it either way, but the rules on Close Combat are pretty explicit on what is different between close combat and ranged combat, and this is not one of the things that's listed.



#4 felkor

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 02:41 AM

On a thematic note, though, it does make perfect sense to me that the guy who is out in the open is going to get if face punched first.  It'll take an extra couple seconds to get at the chumps hiding behind the crates.



#5 felkor

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 06:00 AM

Got an official answer from FFG:


> Rule Question:
> In close combat attacks, does the defender still use obscuration rules to determine what miniatures get removed in what order?
>
> I.E. miniatures not obscured get removed first, and miniatures blocked by all attacking miniatures cannot be removed.
>
> Am I correct that this rule still is in effect for close combat attacks?

That is correct!

I hope this has answered your question. Happy Gaming! :)


Zach Tewalthomas
Assoc. Miniatures Games Producer
Fantasy Flight Games
ztewalthomas@fantasyflightgames.com
 






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