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Question about Femme Fatale


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#1 drake_hoard

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 11:01 AM

Hi,

there is a part on Femme fatale, which is a bit unclear to us:

When install, chose ice. When encounter that ice spend 1 Cred per subroutine to bypass.

This is obvious regardless of the type of the ice, but is it regardless of strength too, since the rules on page 16 states: "An icebreaker can only interact withice that has equal or lower strenght…"



#2 radiskull

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 11:14 AM

Yes.  You have to match strength to break subroutines.  You don't have to break strength to use Femme Fatale's bypass ability.



#3 sparCc

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 07:18 AM

Hi,

i got some problems and questions about Femme Fatale myself. It would be nice if u could reffer any answers to a source a give a detailed explanation.

I allready searched a lot on forums and stuff and couldnt find a good explanation for the following problems.

 

1)    If u play Femme Faltale (FF) u persumably can choose unrezzed ice for the "special ability" (what i will call the ability to choose a piece of ice and      then  bypass any ice of that kind by spending one cred.).

If u have choosen a unrezzed piece of ice… how does the special ability work? Does it, untill the ice is rezzed, mean that FF can bypass any kind of ice, since the unrezzed piece of ice has no spcific type (but still is a ice … see Cyripsis) and the Runner owning FF cant know the ice´s tipe untill its rezzed.

Or does it mean that the FF special ability has simply no effect untill the choosen ice is rezzed since the inactive ice is just a program on the server…

 

2) What happens if the Ice choosen by  FF´s special ability stays unrezzed and is trashed by the corp., simply by installing a nother piece of ice over the choosen one?

 

Would be nice to hear ure oppinion!

And PLEASE FFG TEAM open a FAQ page on the Netrunner Mainpage to clear such fundamental questions since the once regarding Femme Fatale are no the only ones discussed at LCG Forums.

thx alot

greetz

SparCc

 



#4 jjcole

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 07:42 AM

EDIT: My mistake, wasn't clear on the card text.



#5 PWBrian

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 07:46 AM

 

 

sparCc said:

 

1)    If u play Femme Faltale (FF) u persumably can choose unrezzed ice for the "special ability" (what i will call the ability to choose a piece of ice and      then  bypass any ice of that kind by spending one cred.).

If u have choosen a unrezzed piece of ice… how does the special ability work? Does it, untill the ice is rezzed, mean that FF can bypass any kind of ice, since the unrezzed piece of ice has no spcific type (but still is a ice … see Cyripsis) and the Runner owning FF cant know the ice´s tipe untill its rezzed.

Or does it mean that the FF special ability has simply no effect untill the choosen ice is rezzed since the inactive ice is just a program on the server…

 

2) What happens if the Ice choosen by  FF´s special ability stays unrezzed and is trashed by the corp., simply by installing a nother piece of ice over the choosen one?

 

 

1) Femme Fatale says "When you install Femme Fatale, choose an installed piece of ice. When you encounter that ice, you may spend 1 [Credits] per subroutine on that ice to bypass it."  It does not say that you can use it to bypass any Ice of the same kind, so I wouldn't assume that it's capable of doing so.  It's also important to note that the ability requires that you pay 1 credit per subroutine, so it may cost more than 1 credit depending on how many subroutines the Ice in question has.

2) If the Ice you've chosen is trashed, I imagine you'd just lose that particular ability.

As for a FAQ, one will be produced, but they might wait a little while so they can actually compile a set of Frequently Asked Questions.



#6 Toqtamish

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 08:44 AM

Lukas has already said via email when I asked him some questions and then asked about the FAQ and this is a direct quote "Patience."



#7 sparCc

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 08:44 AM

But dude… thisd card costs 9 and is realy a bad icebreaker with 2credits: +2 strength….

If a runner could acctualy use this card only to bypass one single ice easier in comparison to a usual icebreaker… why the hell should you play it when the corp can easiely treash thwe choosen piece of ice?

 

Also the Card sais first: "… choose a installed piece of ice. When un encounter that ice…." first the authorr referres to a specific piece of ice naming it "a installed piece of ice"…, then the card creator gives no particular definition what piece of ice is ment by using the FF´s special ability… for example saing: "When you encounter that ice…" the author is not saing THIS ice( in terms of the ice u have choosen when u just played the card…

This i why i think, the card is usable on any type of ice the choosen ice shares its type with…. thats why the author is writing that ice and not this particular ice…

 

And again y should FF be soo damn expansive if you could only use its special ability on one particular piece of ice?!?

 

Would love to read a statement from the FFG-Team concerning this Problem… i hope u guys read the forum =P

 

greetz



#8 Toqtamish

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 08:57 AM

FFG does not reply on the forums. The card clearly says on it "When you install Femme Fatale, choose an installed piece of ice. When you encounter that ice…." If that ice is no longer in play then her ability is no longer relevant. There is no "Problem" as you say.

 



#9 KommissarK

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 09:00 AM

Given the price of the ICE for some of the corps, I would say its useful if viewed as playing two distinct cards - 1 that is a low-level ice breaker, and one that forces the corp to either trash a piece of ICE, or let the runner just walk right on by. If played against a high cost piece of ICE, I'd say its valid.



#10 Toqtamish

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 09:03 AM

Very much so KommissarK. I would hate to see her used on my Heimdall 1.0.



#11 radiskull

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:23 AM

sparCc said:

This i why i think, the card is usable on any type of ice the choosen ice shares its type with…. thats why the author is writing that ice and not this particular ice…

There's absolutely no reading of the card text that supports this interpretation.



#12 sparCc

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Posted 22 September 2012 - 04:28 AM

All right sorry guys… ure totaly right!

The problem is i am german and not that good in english. Since there are no german cards released yet its sometimes quite hard for me not to missanderstand the cardtext or interpret them the right way. Thanks for ure help.

greetz



#13 kaffis

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 04:27 PM

 The ability is useful in that you can take what is normally a very expensive piece of ice to break and make it much cheaper every time you run against it. Even one for which you don't have the right category of icebreaker -- especially useful in the prebuit criminal deck since it has no codebreakers. A really good example is Hadrian's wall… Femme Fatale bypasses it for 2 credits!



#14 Decker1613

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 12:09 PM

OK, I am really late on this, so I hope a get an answer. So when I install FF and pick a unrezzed ice, and that ice is not a Sentry but a code gate. How does this help me? I mean I really can't use it against a code gate because FF is a Sentry, so I don't get the use of this card. It cost way to much to bring up it strength for even a Sentry ice, sounds like a waist of bits. Can someone show me a good example on why you would want to use this card and how its effects work. Thank you for your time :)



#15 radiskull

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 12:13 PM

Who says you can't use FF on a Code Gate? FF says "you may bypass the selected ice". It says absolutely nothing about the type of ice in that ability.

 

Now, a different ability on FF says "break sentry subroutine", but that is an entirely different ability.

 

Femme Fatale is not a Sentry, it is an Icebreaker and a Killer, and those subtypes are completely irrelevant unless another card or the rules refer to them in some way.

 

Femme Fatale's ability lets you bypass the ice you've selected because Femme Fatale's text says you can (and you don't need to match strength).



#16 Decker1613

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 08:29 AM

Thank you for the input, now it makes sense to me. Now to build a deck. :)



#17 manthos88

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Posted 18 February 2014 - 05:00 AM

I 've got another question about Femme Fatale: Does its ability to bypass a chosen piece of Ice still apply if Femme Fatale gets trashed?

 

My thoughts are that: yes, it does. There isn't any clarification on the card that specifies that Femme Fatale must be in the Runner's Rig in order for its ability to apply. Nor it's a paid ability. It only says: When you install Femme Fatale, "this" happens.


Edited by manthos88, 18 February 2014 - 05:01 AM.


#18 etherial

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Posted 18 February 2014 - 07:57 AM

The ability to Bypass is part of the card. If Femme Fatale is no longer in play, you may no longer pay to Bypass. If you play a new Femme Fatale, even if it is the same physical card, you choose a new piece of ICE (which could be the same piece of ICE).

 

Cards in play have an effect. Cards not in play do not have an effect.


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#19 nungunz

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Posted 18 February 2014 - 09:00 AM

If Femme Fatale is in the heap, then it is not installed and therefor not active.  Cards that aren't active can't use their abilities. 


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#20 aegean

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 01:36 AM

I have another question about FF.... the ability works every round or just the round you installed it?




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