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How would you conquer the Jericho reach?


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#41 Radwraith

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:26 AM

Radwraith said:

I agree with the Poster who suggested bringing in Rogue traders. I would use them primarily in the Chaos and Nid Salients. To entice them to come I would offer "Letters of Marque" that would pay a bounty (paid in the form of achievment points) for each ship destroyed or captured. This would be in addition to any salvage or other profits they manage to get from the encounter. This would help attract the smaller hungrier set of RT Captains who "only' command raiders and frigates. I would encourage Larger Dynasties to operate in the Chaos Salient with promises to recognize their legitimacy when founding or liberating colonies in this region as well as Exclusive trade rights for extended periods etc. 

I would Concentrate My more powerful Naval Capital ships (Battleships and their associated battlegroups) in the Tyranid Salient. Imperial forces have the best chances of success against the Nids in space as well as the opportunity to catch the major "Kraken" class vessels as they "Feed" off of recently conquered planets. Any of these major vessels destroyed will be a devasting blow to tyranid forces in the region. 

The major ground offensives I would confine mostly to The Tau Salient. While I agree that this is the weakest miltary force of the three it also presents the greatest opportunity to garner recources withouth the threat of some sort of "residual contamination" from the previous owner. Also; The Tau have no answer for many of the Imperium's best units (I have never seen anything that spoke to a Tau equivalent of a Titan!). This is true both in space and on the ground. Additionaly, thus far the Tau have shown no affinity for psychic powers nor any particular defence agains them! These factors make the Tau salient the most ready for conquest IMHO.  

Radwraith said:

I agree with the Poster who suggested bringing in Rogue traders. I would use them primarily in the Chaos and Nid Salients. To entice them to come I would offer "Letters of Marque" that would pay a bounty (paid in the form of achievment points) for each ship destroyed or captured. This would be in addition to any salvage or other profits they manage to get from the encounter. This would help attract the smaller hungrier set of RT Captains who "only' command raiders and frigates. I would encourage Larger Dynasties to operate in the Chaos Salient with promises to recognize their legitimacy when founding or liberating colonies in this region as well as Exclusive trade rights for extended periods etc. 

I would Concentrate My more powerful Naval Capital ships (Battleships and their associated battlegroups) in the Tyranid Salient. Imperial forces have the best chances of success against the Nids in space as well as the opportunity to catch the major "Kraken" class vessels as they "Feed" off of recently conquered planets. Any of these major vessels destroyed will be a devasting blow to tyranid forces in the region. 

The major ground offensives I would confine mostly to The Tau Salient. While I agree that this is the weakest miltary force of the three it also presents the greatest opportunity to garner recources withouth the threat of some sort of "residual contamination" from the previous owner. Also; The Tau have no answer for many of the Imperium's best units (I have never seen anything that spoke to a Tau equivalent of a Titan!). This is true both in space and on the ground. Additionaly, thus far the Tau have shown no affinity for psychic powers nor any particular defence agains them! These factors make the Tau salient the most ready for conquest IMHO.  

I am resurrecting this post to make a point: For all the talk about a "Ceasefire" (Read: Surrender!) with the Tau, Why not take THEIR territory first? Obviously, there are a number of valuable resources available from this salient. Since the Tau are NOT a military match for the Imperium  it is basic strategy 101 to attack where you have the greatest odds of success! Sniper teams and Kill teams need to ensure top priority is given to taking out any and all Ethereals that can be found. This cuts the head off the snake. Newly conquered populations should be treated as gently as possible in order to alleviate the brainwashing of the "Greater good" and reindoctrinate them to the virtuous worship of the God-Emperor! The additional resources can then be allocated to support other endeavors in the other two salients!



#42 macd21

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 11:44 AM

professor_kylan said:

Because the Tau don't win through military might. They win through coersion, brainwashing, and societal infiltrating. Once they manage to worm their way into a planet's society, they send a bunch of brainwashed xeno-cultists out to try to garne more support for the Greater Good, while peacefully neutralising the culture they've taken over. Just because they don't like to stand and fight, doesn't make them safe. With the tyranids and archenemy forces destroyed, the best the Tau could hope for after a ceasefire or merging of forces is to have the entire Reach seceed from the Imperium of Man.

Nope, not a chance. They simply don't have the resources for it. Yes, the Tau like to use diplomacy and subversion where possible, but there's only so much you can do with that. And the Imerium is not without its own defences in this regard. The Tau were able to turn some of the isolated worlds of the Reach during their long seperation from the Imperium, but that's a much easier task than wresting away worlds currently tended to by the Ecclesiarchy and the Inquisition.

Deal with the 'nids and chaos and defeating the Tau will be a fairly simple operation. They don't have the forces in the Reach to hold out against the combined might of the Crusade and are too far away from the Empire to get enough support to turn them back. The only way this would change would be if the Warp Gate was destroyed.

coolzyg said:

It's kinda funny that guy with tau avatar trying to persuade us that Tau aren't dangerous and we should all join greater goo… I mean that Imperium should make temporary ceasefire

:D

Are you talking about me? Because I don't have a Tau avatar.



#43 macd21

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 11:49 AM

Radwraith said:

 

I am resurrecting this post to make a point: For all the talk about a "Ceasefire" (Read: Surrender!) with the Tau, Why not take THEIR territory first?

Because the Imperium can't spare the forces from the other two Salients to do so. They can't make peace with the 'nids or chaos to allow them to divert those troops. The can make peace with the Tau. This has two benefits - it frees up a huge amount of troops that can be moved to one of the other salients and it also further blunts 'nid advances by allowing the Tau to do likewise.

This is currently the Crusade High Command's plan. The Tau would also be happy with such an arrangement. Ebongrave is the only one stopping it from going ahead.



#44 Misha

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 02:43 AM

I object! You can't just get rid of Ebongrave. He knows the true way frowards. Kill the Tau, burn, punish and torture their foul kind. Only he can win that front. We cannot risk such a perilous action, he and only he understands the threat of the Xenos!

 

(I like Ebongrave) :)



#45 Killbeggar

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 01:50 PM

Apologize (grovel) to the Black Templars and convince them that another crusade is needed. They would be more than happy to go Godzilla on whomever they are pointed at.

Send them against the Tau and you get the planets back, albeit with a greatly reduced population.

Send them against Chaos and their expansion on that front would come to a screeching halt as the traitors found a foe as batpoo crazy as them.

Send them against the nids and the Black Templars would see if they could digest chainswords.

:D


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#46 Misha

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 06:00 PM

The Tyranids are the main threat because they have a massive amount of troops(animals). So call in the Ultramarines! Tyrranic war veterans are reccomended for a happy day. There are several good reasons to 'win' over the Ultramarines. These are Tyranids and so must be destroyed, it gives Chaplain Cassius a chance to learn and kill his most hated foe and the hive fleet is a splinter fleet from Behemoth.

 

In reply to what Killbeggar said I do agree that Black Templars should be good for the job. They are crazy, psychotic and generally very excellant killers. I wonder if High Command could presuade the Space Wolves to come back. This time bringing Logan Grimnar.


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#47 venkelos

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 05:29 AM

Everyone saying "kill Ebongrave!", I can back that, but it's being said from the perspective of readers. Few people in the game know how wacko he is, whether that's actually good or bad for his current assignment, so no one's planning his murder, except maybe some Tau. Also, stamping out the Tau really doesn't gain anything. It will cost troops, gain no troops, and while resources are great, it's letting Chaos and Hive Fleet spread.

 

Everyone saying "call in the _________________ (Black Templars/Ultramarines)", if they could, I believe they would have. We need to remember that Space Marines are a finite resource, and the Imperium has a million other wars it's prosecuting. It doesn't probably have free companies of the above mentioned Astartes to throw in. Also, screw those Space Marines, because a similar force almost ate McCragge, and that was with Marneous Calgar himself in command. The greatest living Space Marine, and as many more of his best as it takes to man his capital world almost lost to a similar foe. These Nids are more spread out, and there are other threats to stab the Astartes in the back, crippling them in front of the Devourer. The Black Templars might fare better, but Nids evolve really fast, and the Dagon Overlord is akin to the Swarmlord, that basically DID kill Calgar, except for he burned a Fate point, or three.

 

Luckily, the new Nid Codex has a really nice bit where it addresses Nids vs. Chaos, so I think those two fighting actually would be the best option.

 

One thing I really do wish, though is that the Imperium had a real goal in the Reach, beyond "it exists, therefore it is ours." It would help so much if the Reach wasn't just a map in a computer game, and the simulation's only winning condition wasn't "Exterminate!" with three computer-controlled enemies, and none of them actively fighting each other. Being the Kra'hen in Imperium Galactica 2 was fun, don't get me wrong, without worrying about assassinations, espionage, or diplomacy, but once more than two other empires knew about you, they often forwent hitting each other, either because they were "allied", or because they were waiting for covert elements to weaken each other first, and they smashed into me, who can't be reasoned with. That's the Imperium. "We want it all, with none of you in it, and screw the losses!" except that the Kra'hen used their whole race, while the Imperium, again, is everywhere, fighting many other wars it might not even remember it is fighting. There is such a thing as too big. If there was just a thing to capture, or kill, or retrieve, rather than "victory!, the last alien scum!, and every planet in the Reach!", the war would seem more feasible. Things held by Chaos and the Nids aren't usually even kosher with the Imperium, so I don't know what they plan to have left, once the war is won, if it ever can be.


Edited by venkelos, 09 July 2014 - 05:45 AM.


#48 Misha

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 06:07 AM

Now I don't want to get in to an argument but if you've read the main rulebook carefully then you would know that it mentions that the Ultramarines are interested but haven't sent a fleet yet. The reason they are interested is because rumours say that Hive Fleet Dagon is a Splinter fleet of Behemoth, the same fleet that devestated Ultramar and almost destroyed the Ultramarines.

 

About saying Black Templars have a better chance of surviving is bull(no offence Killbeggar). I'm talking about Tyrranic war veterans here. They are writing their own codex worth of anti-tyranid tactics. Also they are Ultramarines pretty much good at everything, able to adapt to most circumstances. Even ten can make a difference. Not in direct combat but because the Tyrranic war veterans are experts in teaching. Don't forget their leader is a mad, injured and psychotic killer that has a boltgun only good for killing tyranids. They can train the Space Marines fghting the nids and make them better. Still say high command should get Logan. Sigh, if only that could happen.

 

About making the nids fighting chaos... yeah that would be beautiful.


Edited by Misha, 09 July 2014 - 06:10 AM.


#49 RogalDorn01

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 07:16 AM

I am actually planning on introducing a mission based on this post where the players are contacted by an inquisitor that they have worked with at some future point in the game.  And that he proposes an audacious and Radical mission to introduce a large number of Cryo-stored genestealers onto a Stigmartus recruitment world on the other side of the Hadex Anomoly with the aid of a particularly dashing Rogue Trader as transport.  The idea being that it will take time, but it could theoretically draw the hive fleets into the Acheros Salient from the other side.  I think it will raise interesting questions about how far the players are willing to go in the name of accomplishing their goals.  I've always thought the conflict between orthodox and radical inquisitors plays well with getting your characters roleplaying!


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#50 Misha

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 06:18 PM

Interesting idea, but extremely dangerous. I mean Genestealers? Wouldn't the side effect being we have to fight corrupted Stigmaratus forces? Still purely radical. I love it. :)

You should add a Puritan who would prefer the mission to fail in an 'accident'. Maybe he has a personal vendetta against the radical? The puritan could send in an assassin to start sabotaging even letting out the Genestealers on the ship causing mass chaos. The rogue trader has some secret to hide, because he is corrupted. This mission is really good for making lots of enemies. Good luck!



#51 RogalDorn01

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:58 AM

I do so enjoy giving my players a rope and letting them pull it until they have just enough to hang themselves...

 

But yeah I think that will be a fun one, and I would be very happy if they pull it off and then 4-5 years later it actually WORKS!!!


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#52 Gurkhal

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:35 AM

Just kill and burn every single freakish heretic and Xenos and we'll be alright. 

 

I could buy getting into defensive with the Tau while the Nids are dealt with but ceasefire? Never! Those freaking Xenos will continue their crimes of subversion and existance no matter what the Imperium does to them and giving them a ceasefire would also look bad for morale. Don't give an inch to the Alien.



#53 Misha

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Posted 13 July 2014 - 05:49 AM

Getting defensive against the Tau is harder than it looks. Firstly it gives the Tau the ability to subvert worlds without being distracted and it allows the Tau to resupply and rearm, something the Imperium lacks. An assault is needed, spearheaded by the Astartes and led by some of Humanity's greatest heroes. Ceasefire will not be considered. 

 

If the Imperium wants to take over the Jericho Reach, then they will have to take desperate measures. Exterminatus on tyranid worlds, geonocidal killings against the Tau and lots of men, guns and sweat thrown against the Chaos. Yet even all this probably would not win Jericho Reach. What the forces in Jericho Reach need is more Rogue Traders, more Inquisition forces and more assassins. Also we need a presence of Grey Knights. More Grey Knights!



#54 Gurkhal

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 08:24 AM

Getting defensive against the Tau is harder than it looks. Firstly it gives the Tau the ability to subvert worlds without being distracted and it allows the Tau to resupply and rearm, something the Imperium lacks. An assault is needed, spearheaded by the Astartes and led by some of Humanity's greatest heroes. Ceasefire will not be considered. 

 

If the Imperium wants to take over the Jericho Reach, then they will have to take desperate measures. Exterminatus on tyranid worlds, geonocidal killings against the Tau and lots of men, guns and sweat thrown against the Chaos. Yet even all this probably would not win Jericho Reach. What the forces in Jericho Reach need is more Rogue Traders, more Inquisition forces and more assassins. Also we need a presence of Grey Knights. More Grey Knights!

 

I like how you think. :)


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#55 Annaamarth

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 04:05 AM

Assuming that the assets in the Reach aren't about to change dramatically (The besought Astartes chapters are busy, the AdMech is disinterested in showing up, no additional Titan Legions, NO MORE GREY KNIGHTS, &c), then the quickest routes to shake things up are with the readily-available supply of Rogue Traders, the assets of the already-present Inquisition, and politics.

 

A Rogue Trader or Inquisitor is in a good position to recognize Ebongraves idiocy.  Because of the nature of Imperial politics, someone, somewhere already wants him dead.  Support them long enough to send Ebongrave to his Ebon Grave.

 

Back off on the Greyhell Front.  The Tau may be weaker than a Tyranid Hive Fleet or the powers of Chaos supported by an Anomaly, but that doesn't make them pushovers.  Bring in Rogue Traders on Greyhell- they'll make better Counter-Insurgency leaders than any Imperial Grand High Lord Commander-Marshall, and if any Cold Trade comes of it, it will be de facto siphoning war material from the Tau.

 

Reinforce the Tyranid front, but encourage Inquisitorial assets to draw the Hive Fleet towards the Anomaly and Greyhell.  Force the other powers to split attention as well.  Chaos forces have never shown interest in recruiting the Hive, and it seems likely that they'll want to keep the worlds they have that aren't in the Anomaly.  It's also worth noting that the Hive has never shown any interest in diving face-first into Warpstorms, presumably because it likes it's existence uncorrupted, thank you very much. The whole 'Shadow in the Warp' bit suggests that the Hive Fleet becalms the warp to me, rather than provoking a warp storm.  I could be wrong, though.

 

Drawing the 'Nids toward the Chaos front would be a strategic coup of the greatest magnitude.  Forcing Chaos to split their forces means it's that much harder for them to devote time and effort to summoning daemonships and soulgrinder vessels, or develop a ritual that sinks the entire sector into the warp.  This would allow the Imperium to back off of the Chaos front and devote even more effort to annihilating Dagon.


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#56 Ramellan

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 12:31 PM

Quick question, how many campaigns out there are actually focusing on every enemy of the Reach? Feels like you could have a whole storyline dedicated to each of them if you wanted. My group hasn't done much with Chaos yet, they're just mentioned in the background. So far it's mostly been Nids and Tau, and now Orks.

Annaamarth's idea I like, but I'm not sure how you would 'draw' Nids in the first place. Have a fleet of ships leave a world lost to the Nids and have it head straight for the Anomaly? Sounds like a one-way trip to me.

#57 Annaamarth

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 07:51 PM

You have a kill team.  Be creative.


RIP AND TEAR THROUGH THE TIDE OF BLOOD WITH BATTLESUIT PILOT. SUPLEX HIVE TYRANTS. DO WHATEVER, YOU'RE PILOTING A HUGE-ASS MECHA.

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#58 SpoonR

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Posted 23 July 2014 - 07:25 AM

Do we know how fast Tyranid's can travel?  Assuming it is slow enough, you can buy a few years with scorched earth tactics. Do an Exterminatus on planets in their path. No biomass (it's all dead/fusioned/evaporated) means the Tyr can't "refuel". Go pure defense in one of the other salient (probably Tau would be easiest for that), and go all out in the third. Smash Chaos really good then go back to Tyranid and Tau.  And I love the idea of siccing Rogue Trader's on the Tau. The Mechanicus would probably want to give extra aid to the Trader's so they could get their servoarms on Tau tech.

 

Oh, and as far as reconquering Tyranid worlds, there aren't any to reconquer. They don't bother leaving spores behind, no need. They take everything of use from the planet, including the atmosphere, and move on leaving a worthless husk behind. Check out the table in the wiki:

http://wh40k.lexican...ry_Assimilation



#59 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 23 July 2014 - 07:40 AM

Annaamarth's idea I like, but I'm not sure how you would 'draw' Nids in the first place. Have a fleet of ships leave a world lost to the Nids and have it head straight for the Anomaly? Sounds like a one-way trip to me.

 

Mature 'Stealer cults project a psychic beacon which attracts the hive fleets. The aforementioned plan of infesting stigmartus worlds is not a bad one to buy time.



#60 venkelos

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Posted 23 July 2014 - 06:13 PM

Do we know how fast Tyranid's can travel?  Assuming it is slow enough, you can buy a few years with scorched earth tactics. Do an Exterminatus on planets in their path. No biomass (it's all dead/fusioned/evaporated) means the Tyr can't "refuel".

I wouldn't put it past the Nids to get around this. A certain amount of the vast Hive Fleet, once it doesn't need to be spent on battling slogging Imperial forces, could instead be spent on being cannibalized, prolonging the survivability of the Hive Fleet, when worlds cannot be located in the vicinity. Eventually, even the Imperium will have to stop ext tactics, either because they'll run out of exterminatus devices, or because they won't have anything left in that salient, and then there wasn't much of a point, and even a single world can probably cause a growth explosion of the Hive Fleet.

 

I do like the idea of letting Rogue Traders loose on the Tau, so long as they can be relied upon not to side with the xenos scum, but I really wish that there was a good way to get Chaos to fight the Nids, just to use them both up, if nothing else.


Edited by venkelos, 23 July 2014 - 06:14 PM.





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