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Questions and more questions! (ADWD spoilers)


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#41 Ire

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Posted 17 August 2011 - 05:59 AM

People meantioning that characters cannot die in their own chapters considering Jon Snow, we have had several prologue and epilogue characters die (yes I know they are lesser characters) in their own chapters.

Also are we sure that Brienne is not dead? ;) she could be once dead and revived or even someone else as there is thoros of myr who could possibly do the same trick Melisandre did with Mance. (There is even the strong item to bind it, the Oathkeeper).



#42 AegonTargaryen

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Posted 17 August 2011 - 11:23 PM

I don't agree with any of you on Meereen or on the alleged "bad character development" on the part of Daenerys. This time I really liked the Meereen parts. The eastern culture was much more fleshed out and a lot of interesting moral dilemmas were posed to Daeny there.  Funny, by the way, how so many people who detest Tywin Lannister want Daeny just to become like him. But she is still a very young woman who still has a lot to learn, and I am glad that Martin gives her time and opportunity to develop, instead of just making her the stereotypical "young hero of the hour" who jumps on the back of her oh-so-willing-but-of-course-still-very-dangerous dragon. Read Eragon if you want this nonsense. In the end, only all her hard choices, failings and mistakes and the real experience she gains through this will give her character true legitimacy to finally become the Saviour / the Hero / the Ruler or whatever Martin holds in petto for her.

I also don't get any of this whining about "the storyline" not having been advanced. There was SO much going on in Dance, more than in any book except maybe Storm of Swords. Maybe it's not the storyline everybody else has made up in the past years, but I am glad that Martin still writes these books, and not everybody else.

I admit there should have been one climax including some story-resolution in the end, though. But I also read that it was Martin's editor who is mainly responsable for that.

 

 

 

 

 



#43 madkasel

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Posted 22 August 2011 - 02:23 PM

I think you're somewhat in the minority with your strong positve reaction, Aegon. (though it was nice to see that your head wasn't smashed by the Lannisters as a baby!)

For myself... I really like the books and enjoy Martin's style, but I'm no longer "in his cult."



#44 JerusalemJones

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 10:36 AM

The more I think back on this book, the more I mull over the events that took place, and the more I look at the story as a whole, the more I appreciate Dance (and, slightly, Feast). In this series, much like David Gerrold does in my other favorite books series "The War Against the Chtorr," Martin shows us how, even in the face of an outside threat to our survival, people will still fight amongst themselves for the trappings of power. This is a series about the characters, not the events, though the events are epic in scope. And the history is so damn rich, every glimpse into the past is a joy for me.

I can easily say that Dance is my second favorite book of the series, and it could possibly pass Storm, but it may take a few more re-reads for that to happen.



#45 AegonTargaryen

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:21 PM

JerusalemJones said:

 

...  Martin shows us how, even in the face of an outside threat to our survival, people will still fight amongst themselves for the trappings of power. This is a series about the characters, not the events, though the events are epic in scope. And the history is so damn rich, every glimpse into the past is a joy for me.

I can easily say that Dance is my second favorite book of the series, and it could possibly pass Storm, but it may take a few more re-reads for that to happen.

 

 

Well said .

That is almost exactly how most of my friends and I feel about Dance.



#46 AegonTargaryen

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:21 PM

madkasel said:

... (though it was nice to see that your head wasn't smashed by the Lannisters as a baby!) ...

 



#47 rings

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Posted 30 August 2011 - 10:38 AM

My 5th favorite out of 5.  At least at the end of 4 it really ramped up - especially the Cercei stuff. 

Nothing happened.  Seriously.  A bunch of stuff kind of happened, and then didn't.  A camping excursion up North, its COLD!.  Some sailing aruond, some SHIPS!.  Dany whining again for 10 chapters - to the point that for the 2nd straight book I skipped her stuff and then read it afterwards.  We knew she was going to ride a dragon since the end of the first book.  WOO_HOO it happened! 

I was hoping repeated times for some major action.  When Dany was getting married I was all geared up for something.  And then she is married. Then various semi-major characters were all on their way to 'rescue' her from 10 more chapters of whining...and then didn't get there. 

I was geared up for Jon to lead SOMEBODY to war again.  And then he gets psuedo-killed (BTW Martin has gotten more and more into this - more main characters have been brought back from apparent death than killed in the last three books by a ratio of 5:1 by my unofficial count). 

I am sure people will say that Martin was doing this on purpose, or surprising us with lack of surprises or something crazy.  But what I loved about his books were that they were packed with EVENTS.  Surprises.  Maybe I have read him enough to be unimpressed by the 'surprises' (i.e. usually SOMEONE IS ALIVE AGAIN!!!). 

The epoligue was by far the best chapter.  And it wasn't the 5th best in 3 or 2.  *shrug*  Like MadK it has lost the luster a bit.  It took me weeks to finish the book, I was expecting a day or two. 

That all being said, I am really optimistic about #6...all this setting up HAS to go somewhere! 

Good to read the various thoughts on the questions though...some interesting theories! 


Oh, King eh? Very nice...

#48 rings

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 05:48 AM

BTW, saw this thread today - so funny.tigerbeatdown.com/2011/08/26/enter-ye-myne-mystic-world-of-gayng-raype-what-the-r-stands-for-in-george-r-r-martin/


Oh, King eh? Very nice...

#49 Saturnine

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 07:12 AM

rings said:

The always illuminating Sean Collins has a neat deconstruction of Sady's form of criticism on his excellent ASoIaF blog

For all the eye-rolling I do when reading Sady's piece, I have to admit I too thought George Martin was a perv when I read Dany & Drogo's first night.



#50 SummerSeaCaptain

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 10:38 AM

 Hi everyone,

I really liked ADWD. It is not the best, but it set the pieces on the whole board and I 'm really looking out to the development of the history.

Some thoughts that weren't rised yet (or that I didn't notice it).

- I've always thought that Dany had to reunite the Dothraki and use them to swap out the Yunkaii. Now it seems that it will be so, but that's normal: she is the mother of dragons, and her son ("Drogon") is the stallion that rides over the world". I think that dany will discover (from the top of Drogon) that the world is round, and that she can go west (to westeros) by going east ;-) (quaithe rulez). The elegant part is that going to westeros from east and circumnavigating the globe, it will mean that she must pass through the Iron Islands, and I can see that happen with Victarion around...

- The Kettlebacks were creatures of Littlefinger, it will be nice to see how everything plays out for him without anyone in King's Landing. I'm personally an huge fans of lord Baelish, I love how he is one who can value someone because is good at something and not because is noble (like all the lowborn people that he placed as lord of coin). Very "revolutionary french".

- Davos had an interesting conversation about Ned Stark with the lord Rodryck of the sweetsisters. I really do not know why, but I think on Skagos (during the journey in search of Rickon) he will learn some truth about Jon Snow. My gut says it. I just think that is not a coincidence that Martin has him involved, thanks this conversation, with the subplot of Jon's origin.

- What about Jaime and Brienne? She is alive, that means she has agreed to search an kill Jaime. But will she? Any thoughts?

this last point is not relevant with ADWD but.....has anyone noticed that Jon knows that the direwolf of Bran is named Summer, although Jon was already gone when bran named him? I know it could be easily explained (some raven send from winterfell to jon), but it still drives me crazy that this was just left happen without explanation :-P



#51 Mortuss

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 12:00 PM

 I have a question : since throughout the book wildlings and crows have been kinda uniting , will we be able to play wildlings and nights watch agendas together once again? :)



#52 Mighty Jim

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 04:36 AM

Mortuss said:

 I have a question : since throughout the book wildlings and crows have been kinda uniting , will we be able to play wildlings and nights watch agendas together once again? :)

Only if you want to get repeatedly stabbed at the end of the game






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