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Block vs. Dodge?


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#1 JesterX

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 04:22 PM

Why would someone invest in block when you can always dodge? 



#2 Hailene

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 08:35 PM

You can stop AoE attacks (including energy AoE attacks like fireballs with aura extrusion).  You can use shields to help your blocking.  Certain classes (paladins) have class bonuses to block.  Block also gets equipment bonuses (from +5/+10/+15 weapons).  Also both attack and block use dex.  This rather than spreading two good stats, you can focus on one for your combat needs.



#3 MalVolentes

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Posted 19 September 2010 - 07:14 AM

It's partly just flavour that some characters are blockers and some are dodgers, but there are certainly quite a few benefits to using a shield in the game. Dodge can never benefit from equipment bonuses, and the two styles do have different characteristics. Out in the open being able to dodge is great, but in a tight environment, such as a 5ft wide dungeon corridor the guy with the shield and sword style should be the one at the front.

A group should preferably have one of each type of fighter, and non-combat types should stick to Dodge (or rely on magic/psi projection most of the time or get the High priestess or chariot invocations as soon as possible for summoners). 



#4 commanderq

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 06:28 AM

Lol, Because Attack and Block are both tied to DEX, wereas with Dodge you need high agility.  Also shields give you much more block than dodge.  Basiclly what it boils down to is if you have enough stats to have high dodge and attack, go for it.  However if you are playing a cross classed fighter, like a pychic warrior or warlock you wont have enough stats for strength, dexterity, agility, will power or power.  You want 8s and 9s in these stats, and its unlikely that you will have enough.

Also as mentioned before blocking is only bad if you dont have Ki or a shield.  Its pretty easy to eliminate the penelties involved with blocking.



#5 BinaryWraith

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Posted 05 October 2010 - 12:37 PM

The fact that you reduce the penalties to block ranged attacks, instead of dodging them is also important!



#6 Hailene

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Posted 05 October 2010 - 06:17 PM

BinaryWraith said:

The fact that you reduce the penalties to block ranged attacks, instead of dodging them is also important!

But at any given point dodge would be better.  Unmastered dodge and unmastered, shieldless block is -30 versus -80 against fired projectiles.  And 0 versus -30 against thrown projectiles. 

 

It evens up if you have a shield and mastered neither at -30 a pop.  But that means you're forced to take a shield and say, can't dual wield or use a two-hander (unless you stick with a buckler).

 

And even if you master block you have to tack on a shield to reduce the penalties to zero.



#7 CyrusRangue

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Posted 07 October 2010 - 08:44 AM

From a purely statistical point of view, you're sort of right. dodge has less penalties against ranged attacks than block when you're shieldless. The GM Toolkit added a style module that lets you treat a twohander as a shield. As for dual wield, the character is probably a hit and run type and the two weapons means that you don't necessarily need high str to do decent damage, so you could build high dex and high agi. That kind of character would focus on hitting well and often rather than devastatingly.

Also, as it was stated before, there are situations where I would say dodge wouldn't work as well. I assume that excepting for at very high rolls of dodge you need to have space to get out of the way of an attack, you aren't matrix graze-dodging everything that comes at you. Where with block you can stand there and attempt to stop the attack dead, no need to move.



#8 Ghost49X

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Posted 17 January 2014 - 10:09 PM

They both have their own advantages, but I'd like to point out that a character with block can dodge at a penality (-60) and vice versa.

 

See Table 25 in the core book (not the core exxet)



#9 Latoshi

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Posted 18 January 2014 - 03:06 PM

On top of that dodging is very hard to do if your environment does not allow it. Dodging in small spaces may not even be possible, making block a necessity as it does not require room to move


People are not failures simply because they try and fail.

Only when they fail and give up have they truely failed.


#10 segara82

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 11:32 PM

What kinda irkes me is if i try to block an area attack i need the ability to block energy or i suffer a -120 to my Block Ability.

The guy dodging only has -80 to his Dodge Ability if there is not enough room to avoid it. Why is there an 40 points gap?

I would need a +10 Full Shield to cover that difference.

See page 93 in the CRB (not the core exxet).


Courage is the mastery of fear - not the absence of fear


#11 Latoshi

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Posted 22 January 2014 - 07:30 AM

Well this is mainly because you are trying to block it with effectivly nothing, I mean this is easily remedied by an artifact or taking presence extrusion, but the fact is when you try to block with a shield you expect it to block the attack but when it goes through without the shield making a difference you have not taken any additional precautions to defend against it. Where dodgers apply such penalties for lack of space but no matter how little space there is they can still move. Blocking does tend to carry with it a lot of downsides and benefits. But this is just my view on it.


People are not failures simply because they try and fail.

Only when they fail and give up have they truely failed.


#12 Prinnygod

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 04:04 PM

The fact on selecting Dodge or Block come more on the way a player wants to roll his character, just like Cyrusrangue said, there is a combat maneuve in the GM book for the dual user if you want to block being a dual-wielder, you are not forced tp be attached to a shield anyways but using a shield makes it a good way to gain quite some bonuses, on the other hand there is dodge,dodge has its advantages too and you will not be on a small room with no space to dodge all the time, but as insaid its upmto the way a player whants to play, probably whats to play the ally who defends his team, being block the only way to do so if you want to help some one inj trouble, as for dodge you dont really care on protecting your allys, you relive only on yourself, doesnt mean its bad, but every player has his own taste on how to put life to his chara.

#13 ElricOfMelnibone

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 11:16 PM

If you're new to the forum, welcome! Just to make you know: the Second Weapon Defensive Style Module can be used with Dodge as well as Block. It seems strange, but I suppose that since Dual Wield is a typical option for acrobatic warriors and assassins all around, they wanted it to work with ALL kind of characters that used it. Of course a Blocking character can maximize the effects by using weapon+shield.


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#14 segara82

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 04:39 AM

Some of us take Ambydexterity for more offensive qualities. My char is a strong enough Dark Paladin who dualwields 2 great-axes. By adding a Buckler on one arm i can also block ranged attacks without penalty. He is very slow though.

Courage is the mastery of fear - not the absence of fear


#15 ElricOfMelnibone

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 11:22 PM

The good think of using the additional defense module with a shield is that you DON'T require taking ambidexterity, hence having a CP to spend on something else. If you take Ambidexterity you're definitely going to use your seconadary weapon for additional attacks and it's rather hard that you spend it on the additional defense.






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