Jump to content



Photo

The Time Is Now! :D


  • Please log in to reply
9 replies to this topic

#1 Viewtiful_Joe

Viewtiful_Joe

    Member

  • Members
  • 432 posts

Posted 24 November 2009 - 01:58 AM

Over the past few weeks, I've been looking at the way UFS is played, and what can be done to revive the large playerbases the UK once had, as it seems to me that the bad taste left behind by Block 3 still lingers, and nothing has been done to pull players back in for a while. Having looked at the grandeur that is Set 14 (I really do love this set that much), it has occured to me that I should not have to take all this splendour by myself, and that we should spread UFS' wings once again as players, as I think that if such a thing occurs, it may bring the whole thing into FFG's attention a hell of a lot more.

With any luck, I am hoping to be a part of Colchester's Games Club's committee within a few weeks, which will enable me to try and really push UFS' into people's faces :D. I'm thinking starting off with sealed deck tournaments, and using Quest For Souls as a major part of it, possibly using a copy of Soul Calibur IV (which is awfully cheap right now) to try to pull people from outside our normal circle into being interested in partaking. While using outside prizes isn't exactly normal protocol, I say push the boundaries a little bit if the reward is worth it. I could then move on to rekindle the Ladder League I created for last year, as it got quite a fanbase, and the themed tournaments always went down quite well, as it provided something a bit quirky.

I counted up the number of players in Colchester who regularly play UFS and occasionally play it. I discovered that we have 8 people who play regularly, with another 4 who play slightly less regularly, but certainly enough to warrant being spoken of. While some people might say that 12 is not a small number, it isn't big enough for my liking. Having looked around at the people who also play Yugioh and Magic down at our games hall, I reckon that with a push, I could grab at least another 7 or 8 people and convert them to play UFS as regularly as the rest of us. Put simply, I won't be happy until I'm pulling in 20 players per tournament. I haven't held tournaments in a while, purely because I just haven't had time, but if I start up again, I want them to work and I want them to work well.

I'd like to point out how fantastic Ross' legacy banned list is. The reason I have barely looked at legacy is because it just seems so damn boring with all the broken stuff thats sitting at the table. But with this guideline, I think it'll be possible to run more Legacy tournaments and therefore be able to pull back people who used to play UFS, but got bored with the control wars that persisted so often throughout last year and the bigger half of this year. The idea of 'Old Dogs, New Tricks' could also be put to much better use without having complaints about broken characters. So yeah, thank you Ross and the other Sheffield players for that, love it :D

I also think it would be a good idea to try and think of ways to make the forums more active, as mouth of word is what makes these games big, and loioking at how horrifyingly dead these forums have been of late (the UK one in particular). I'm thinking of possibly having everyone who wants to play in tournaments register on the forums so that they can discuss the outcome of tournaments or who they feel is over/underpowered. If we're getting newer players to do this, then it'll encourage older players to try to help them and get involved in the discussions themselves. Perhaps making the UK forum more lively will help to make other players want to look into it and further the game even more. It may also get the rest of the forum buzzing across the pond too in a chain reaction. FFG might not look at the forums all that much, but when prospective new players look at them and don't see a lot happening, it's not going to look interesting, is it?

The reason I've posted this big ol' rant is that I believe that with such a nice set coming through, that it would be nice to get the playerbases of old back, and I wanted to help Colchesters playgroup, and everywhere elses by trying to provide ideas and insights into what might work in getting everyone into NEWFS. I realise that most people believe that FFG should be doing more to advertise their own game than us players should, but the fact of the matter is that they aren't right now, and no amount of complaining is going to change that, so I think that we should take matters into our own hands a little and really push this fabulous game at people as much as possible in order to provide real growth again. Remember when UFS was the 3rd biggest CCG in the world? Wouldn't it be awesome to have that back again? So many peopled do so much work for UFS that it's great as it is (you guys know who you are), but I'd love to be able to go onto these forums and see loads of tournament reports and just lots of people chatting again, because to me, the greatest pull of this game is it's social aspect, and at the moment, it feels like thats been lost a little bit and I really miss it.

Well, hopefully people who read this can take something from it and not just think it's silly ol' Joe ranting again. Hope to hear from everybody soon.

 



#2 Nemesis

Nemesis

    Member

  • Members
  • 161 posts

Posted 24 November 2009 - 06:38 AM

I understand what your saying Joe, during block 3 when you were running the ladder league tournaments there was a large playerbase at the time, but now its sort of died down to a few.

I think the main reason for it is because where rotation happened so quickly the players who would play in the tournaments had only just got there decks upto scrarch then the rotation hit causing them to start from scratch and try and get a collection of the new set with everyone else so its harder for everyone to get the cards they need since everyone else is doing the same thing..

But with the new set I think them players will return, what with a new set of characters and new decks emerging triumphent in tournaments and friendly games..

I will do my bit to help you in your quest to increase our playgroup..



#3 Speedsta

Speedsta

    Member

  • Members
  • 278 posts

Posted 24 November 2009 - 08:26 PM

Aaargh! It's a giant thread! On the UK board! Run for your lives!

Firstly, I understand your post completely and it's great to see that there are still people in the UK who are passionate about the success of UFS. I'd like to wish you the best of luck with expanding your player group and hope it works out better for you than it has for me (I've basically tried everything you mention below over the course of the last year, even giving away about 60 free demo decks and promos at a 150 player Yu Gi Oh tournament) as every time I attract new players from other games, the other players of those games (who often haven't actually tried UFS and refuse to do so) basically put pressure on them to quit UFS and go back to their old game

I don't have much knowledge of your playerbase, are you certain that it is the memories of block three that are causing problems and not the current format? Opinion in the UK is very much split into two camps on this - the first camp feels that UFS had ceased to be either fun or a fighting game with the endless control wars of the past and loves the new format, and the second feels that the new format is lacking in strategy and interactivity. There is a lot of support for each standpoint, and as I fall firmly into the second camp I'll explain my opinion and then let someone else post their feelings from the opposite side.

I have played a lot of deck types in the past, but I seem to be best known for my control decks as these are the ones which have made the biggest impact in tournaments. Although people see me as a control player I am very happy that the control wars ofthe past are gone, because I agree that for the most part players find control games boring and it certainly doesn't do anything to attract new players to the game. However, the new format seems to be the opposite end of the spectrum for me. I have built several aggressive decks and found that the outcome of the game is most often decided by two factors - firstly the coin toss and secondly whether or not any player is playing a character with a kill condition which amounts to an extra turn of speed, e.g. Hilde, Fury of the Ancients. My current two decks are the closest things to control I can build - speed pump reversal lock Lu Chen and aggro control Rashotep. However, these decks KO their opponent on turn three often enough to make it consistent (but not in the majority of games) which raises the question of "If my deck is going to regularly kill on turn three, what's the point of trying to make it control? I may as well put more aggressive cards in and try to kill them on turn 2". This is why I feel that the current format is not interactive - where games only last a few turns, going first or having a built in kill condition tends to make all the difference. There is a lot of damage prevention currently legal, but it is consistently outweighed by the damae pumps, most of the best ones of which are also re-usable.

I've found that using prizes from outside UFS definitely work well to attract interest - If you're lucky you may find some Street Fighter IV action figures reduced for Christmas which would also work well (check your local sci fi stores, e.g. Forbidden Planet).

I'm happy that you like the banned list, the changes to it are down to a trickle now (I plan to add Devil Reverse, and have Signature Style and promo Adon on a watch list), so it should be pretty much finished. If there is anything you feel should be on there please let me know!

I have serious concerns about the future of UFS after this set in regards to FFG support, and I sincerely hope that they are unfounded and that the game continues to be produced and sells well, but we'll see how successful this set is....at the moment the Sheffield playerbase is stable at about 8 people in total which is also a massive from the past when I regularly ran 20+ player events, but I'm not the only person here who worries about the game's future. I'm not sure whether it's the same in Colchester?

Well, I need to start work, so I'll finish rambling about my view of UFS at the moment 

Other views would also be interesting?

 - Ross



#4 Viewtiful_Joe

Viewtiful_Joe

    Member

  • Members
  • 432 posts

Posted 25 November 2009 - 12:43 AM

Speedsta said:

 

I don't have much knowledge of your playerbase, are you certain that it is the memories of block three that are causing problems and not the current format? Opinion in the UK is very much split into two camps on this - the first camp feels that UFS had ceased to be either fun or a fighting game with the endless control wars of the past and loves the new format, and the second feels that the new format is lacking in strategy and interactivity. There is a lot of support for each standpoint, and as I fall firmly into the second camp I'll explain my opinion and then let someone else post their feelings from the opposite side.

Personally, I'd say I was firmly in the first 'camp', because I actually find Legacy painfully boring no matter how long the banned list is, I always like the ebb and flow of a current format, because it's ever changing, but you're right in saying that a lot of people don't agree with me on that front and that opinions are indeed divided. Although I'm not sure that this divide is a problem at all, if anything, it's a good thing. Surely it just means that there are twice as many reasons to play this game as there were before if there are two different ways of playing it? Just because FFG thermselves don't support Legacy, doesn't mean we can't register it as a standard tournment and get prizes that can be used in either standard gameplay or legacy. I'm thinking of asking FFG whether they have any really old rotated stock lying around that could be sold for cheap so that we could try making up Legacy format sealed tournaments, because that way there can't be any complaints about gray wars or broken cards, because part of the whole idea is using what you get from the luck of the draw. It would also raise awareness of Legacy, and bring along the possibilty of bringing back players who played at the games dawn but quit because they didn't like the idea of rotation. (I've found that rotation itself turns an awful lot of players off not just UFS, but Magic and Pokemon too. I personally prefer the idea)

In regards to you saying that people get dragged back into Yugioh, or some of their previous games, I'd say that it is still possible to hook these people, although I understand your difficulty in doing so, I've lost many cards and a lot of time building decks for people that never got used. I've discovered that in order to convert people from one game to another, you need to offer them something they don't already have, otherwise they're just shelling out more money to do what they're already doing. In this case, I'd say the UFS community is the biggest selling point to the game, so that is what we need to shove down people's throats in order to make people think "hold on, maybe this is a better game".
 



#5 Fiddlestix

Fiddlestix

    Member

  • Members
  • 284 posts

Posted 25 November 2009 - 08:47 AM

Hey dude, long time no hear!

I can only offer more of the same I'm afraid. I tried real hard to promote the game in Swindon, and got majorly knocked back when the players got pulled back into Yugey and MTG. This was after giving the buttload of promos, decks from my own collection, creating me own leaflets and posters, promoting at THREE different shops,maintained an upbeat attitude through out. Went from 12 to 3 (and that includes me!) in about two weeks, this was all heartily crippled by:

  • the lack of product being in the shop (don't ask, the two card shop owners need to have a chat!)
  • the set backs in getting stuff, seriously I as supposed to have the Store Champ done ages ago, now its unlikely to happen until the new year.
  • the distinct lack of ANY sort of advertising materials (posters, leaflets, cardboard cut-outs, etc)
  • the now poor prize support (two sets of legal cards, then the rest legacy, hmmmmm......)
  • the minimum size of kits mean a pre-release actually costs MORE that just buying the 6 boosters you were after, which gives me the sneaky suspicion they are making us pay extra to get the hard-to-get promos (also, shop owner won't take on 6 boxes of product if he can't guarantee selling them, meaning new players leave coz they can't buy it, which means less chance of selling all the product, rinse, lather and repeat)

Sorry to be so pessimistic, but I haven't been truly 'inspired' by FFG at the moment. A bad combination of factors have all worked together to really screw this over here in Swindon, and I have no idea what its like elsewhere. Special thanks to Craig and Jay here, as they are the only reason I have to keep playing not only socially, but at all. However, it was very disheartening to have the shop owner point out alot of the above problems, then say I have to work that much harder to try and pull people in coulda cried.

Damn, I've gone and made meself all depressed....

OK, BIG SLAP ON FACE!!! I totally agree with Joe here, we need to do something... the problem is what? FFG seem tough to get anything beyond kits of old stock (which they seem desperate to shift.... suspicious or what?), and people seem to wonder from game to game, but always end up back with the big two.

Suggestions guys? Ideas would be awesome, because as Joe said, what better player base is there?



#6 Son Gopaul

Son Gopaul

    Member

  • Members
  • 266 posts

Posted 25 November 2009 - 10:13 AM

Okay okay, I guess I can put some input on here, but sadly I'm not much of an ideas man. However, I am claimed to be good at teaching new players...

I know I haven't been playing the game that seriously since Tekken came out, maybe once a week at most. But that's been due to other reasons such as being at work more often, and the Christmas period taking up a lot of time (our LGS puts the casual table away for displays, which is fair enough from a sales point of view). That and for some weird reason I've gotten into casual block legal Magic: the Gathering again, but to avoid the torches and pitchforks I'll leave that for another story. THIS IS AN OOFS DISCUSSION!

I have noticed the lack of play, and for the last few weeks I have been blaming the usual stagnation of the game, which occurs just before a set is released. But, as always, FFG have been consistent - in delaying sets, that is. Hearing the set got pushed back last week got me downhearted, as I was originally going to cancel going to Steve's pre-release when I heard the news, only to have Steve put his Store championship forwards instead. This made me feel even worse as I was hoping to go to both events. Hearing the set being pushed back AGAIN now means I doubt I can come to EITHER event, as I have already missed the Store champs. In short, FFG have failed me and all of us again, and it's getting ridiculous.

Before I really get depressed and/or stressed out, I'll move onto a lighter note. Ross, you're a genious in reviving the Legacy format which sounds like it will be a blast. In fact, I'm clearing out the room this week and discovering a lot of old cards, such as Tiger Uppercut and more importantly *Sagat*. I would be awesome to play them all again, not just out of principle but just too see what the newer sets could do for them. For example, my Sagat deck would take a liking to adding Crushing Embrace of the Jotun to it's arsenal. Anyways, the idea of winning more than (the short amount of) promos sounds like a good idea, I've made good use of the Plug in and Play Street Fighter II that I won from the Sheffield Regional (for those that don't know, I was the highest placed deck that didn't run Blood Runs True or Feline Spike - I was playing Hanzo Kick ^_^).

I haven't played seriously since that tournament to be honest, even at Path of the Master I was getting bored of Hanzo. And it's about time I got that fighting spirit back. I'm currently playing King and enjoying it, although it's about time we had some new toys for the small current format. I've made an effort into avoiding looking at the spoilers in detail, because most of the time when I look at spoilers I'm not so interested in the setby the time it finally arrives, and the stagnant feeling creeps over quicker than usual. But based on what I've heard, Yoshimitsu is broken and therefore my second choice, Mitsurugi, is going to be my next deck idea. I'm going to put what little faith I have left into the next set like I did Tekken 6, and hopefully I'll be impressed like I was with Tekken 6. FFG are headed in the right direction with the cards despite the lack of control, but they really need to make an improvement on scheduling releases and promo distribution. This way I can be happy again knowing I support the game and they can support us players.



#7 Speedsta

Speedsta

    Member

  • Members
  • 278 posts

Posted 25 November 2009 - 08:26 PM

Viewtiful_Joe said:

Just because FFG themselves don't support Legacy, doesn't mean we can't register it as a standard tournment and get prizes that can be used in either standard gameplay or legacy.

FFG are fine with supporting Legacy, you can register tournaments in whatever format you like and still get sent the same prizes :)

Viewtiful_Joe said:

In regards to you saying that people get dragged back into Yugioh, or some of their previous games, I'd say that it is still possible to hook these people, although I understand your difficulty in doing so, I've lost many cards and a lot of time building decks for people that never got used. I've discovered that in order to convert people from one game to another, you need to offer them something they don't already have, otherwise they're just shelling out more money to do what they're already doing. In this case, I'd say the UFS community is the biggest selling point to the game, so that is what we need to shove down people's throats in order to make people think "hold on, maybe this is a better game".

That's normally how I promote UFS here too, the problem I face is that Sheffield has a massive Yu Gi Oh player base (our standard monthly tournaments regularly get 150+ players), and the peer pressure against anyone who starts playing UFS tends to be overwhelming. I had one player who was openly laughed at be a group of Yu Gi Oh players for playing another game. I normally have no trouble attracting interest and even getting new players who buy cards, the problem lies with retaining their interest in a game with 8 player tournaments with a few free promos against a game with 150 player tournaments wieh consoles and booster boxes. As mentioned in my post above, I can only hope that you succeed in Colchester and make UFS into a mainstream game again in at least one area of the UK :)

One approach I have found works well is giving away free decks made of commons and uncommons, and pushing the fact that UFS doesn't have a rotating banned list like Yu Gi Oh. I tend to push the community atmosphere more to older players of games other than Yu Gi Oh, and I've found that running side events for Street Fighter IV, etc is a good way to get people interested in UFS :)

Alternatively, you could just throw demo decks at people :P



#8 Cplwilks

Cplwilks

    Member

  • Members
  • 53 posts

Posted 26 November 2009 - 12:30 AM

Speedsta said:

Alternatively, you could just throw demo decks at people :P

I have found people react very violently when you do this

 

I know exactly where everyone is coming from.

I run tournaments at two different stores and they both suffer from problems.

Plymouth has a very large Yugioh playerbase, and that is pretty much it (not 150+, but at least 30-40).  I have the exact same problem as Ross - you manage to convert a couple and they play for a bit, only to get dragged back by their peers and they give all their cards away, only to start again later *rinse and repeat*.  Clearly the interest is there but I have no idea how to keep them!

Thankfully I seem to have picked up a possible 4 new players bringing our group back up to a 'comfortable' 8 players, but still a far cry from the old 20+.

I've also had a lot of interest in Legacy from older players to play on the off-week from Yugioh - our group seems to have gone the complete opposite from Ross's though - WE HAVE NO BANNED LIST AT ALL!  Maybe we're just gluttons for punishment, but I think it's more to do with noone really interested in playing the old cheesy decks.  As a recommendation for Legacy, i'm starting a Legacy League soon.  The store owner is discouting all Legacy stock for these 'tournaments'.  All players get a starter from any set and two boosters to build a deck from.  Each week they get 3 more boosters to supplement their decks.  At the end of each match they can trade one card for card with their opponent.  I've had a lot of interest from players on this as it could lead to some interesting stuff.

As for the other store I play in in Exeter, I have nothing but pain and misery.  Noone can be converted to play.  I mean literally noone.  None of the Magic players are remotely interested and the Pokemon players suffer the same issue as the Yugioh ones in that they soon drift back.  The cost of a Prerelease kit put's sever pressure on the Store owner who is just not seing the point these days of being left with 2-3 boxes of boosters he will never sell - heck I end up buying the majority of the kit in the first place!  He has hundreds of decks and boosters that noone will take but still i'm gonna keep trying!  Any suggesstions would be great....



#9 Fiddlestix

Fiddlestix

    Member

  • Members
  • 284 posts

Posted 26 November 2009 - 09:51 AM

This has to be the first time a Wall-o-txt thread hasn't put me off. Seriously, I think this thread has some potential, does anyone have any other ideas to this most heinous of issues?



#10 Son Gopaul

Son Gopaul

    Member

  • Members
  • 266 posts

Posted 26 November 2009 - 12:52 PM

I know what you mean with the coming and going players that sell their collections, there a two or more of those here in Colchester. However, they only go back to Yu Gi Oh because they can't uphold more than one card game financially, in an ironic way I have the same problem but the other way around. I would like to take up Magic seriously and even delve more into Pokemon as it caught my eye earlier in the year (some of the new Beedrills are nice), but these games I merely dabble in and out of casual games, unlike the serious play I have with UFS.

I can see things from their point of view, and respect their decisions. However, it bothers me to see them keep coming and going, selling their entire collection each time they leave the game. If only we could convince them to keep hold of their cards, and these Legacy ideas might just do that. We need to show more support for Legacy, so no old card goes to waste!

* THE CAMPAIGN FOR LEGACY HAS BEGUN! *
Are you in?






© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS