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Official Nerf Pack


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#21 rugal

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 02:10 AM

The real problem of the conjurer is in act 2. Since no cards offers a boost of defense (at least another grey die), all images will be destroyed easily. And an Image "hit", it means 1 fatigue and 1 damage on it.

 

There's something wrong on this class

 

But it's not the only one. The base card of the bezerker is outdated now, the necromancer needs a real boost, etc ...



#22 Zaltyre

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 06:34 AM

The real problem of the conjurer is in act 2. Since no cards offers a boost of defense (at least another grey die), all images will be destroyed easily. And an Image "hit", it means 1 fatigue and 1 damage on it.

 

There's something wrong on this class

 

But it's not the only one. The base card of the bezerker is outdated now, the necromancer needs a real boost, etc ...

Sure, but I didn't see "keeping image tokens alive" as a goal. Each one can force (or tempt) the OL into using an action to destroy it. If you use them as tools to block a hallway, you're significantly slowing the OL down for some fatigue and the cost of a little health- and unlike the geomancer's stones, it doesn't cost an action to bring them in.

 

But remember- especially in Act 2- if you're using the Image tokens to keep fire off of you- it may absorb an attack of 11 damage, Pierce 3, and you only take 1 damage, 1 fatigue. That's a significant benefit, not a weakness.


Edited by Zaltyre, 21 August 2014 - 06:34 AM.

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#23 Whitewing

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 10:02 AM

 

The real problem of the conjurer is in act 2. Since no cards offers a boost of defense (at least another grey die), all images will be destroyed easily. And an Image "hit", it means 1 fatigue and 1 damage on it.

 

There's something wrong on this class

 

But it's not the only one. The base card of the bezerker is outdated now, the necromancer needs a real boost, etc ...

Sure, but I didn't see "keeping image tokens alive" as a goal. Each one can force (or tempt) the OL into using an action to destroy it. If you use them as tools to block a hallway, you're significantly slowing the OL down for some fatigue and the cost of a little health- and unlike the geomancer's stones, it doesn't cost an action to bring them in.

 

But remember- especially in Act 2- if you're using the Image tokens to keep fire off of you- it may absorb an attack of 11 damage, Pierce 3, and you only take 1 damage, 1 fatigue. That's a significant benefit, not a weakness.

 

 

Next time, try High Mage Quellen as the conjurer. All that stamina.....



#24 AiriusTorpora

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 10:11 AM

 

 

Next time, try High Mage Quellen as the conjurer. All that stamina.....

 

 

He makes one hell of a geomancer too.



#25 Zaltyre

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 01:41 PM

 

 

 

Next time, try High Mage Quellen as the conjurer. All that stamina.....

 

 

He makes one hell of a geomancer too.

 

Yes, but I wanted to see how Shiver's heroic ability would do when combined with "Illusory Path"- +2 MP for monsters to enter any space adjacent to both me and a token! It was beautiful around the water spaces- goblin archers could only move 1 or 2 spaces.



#26 rugal

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 02:23 PM

 

 

 

 

Next time, try High Mage Quellen as the conjurer. All that stamina.....

 

 

He makes one hell of a geomancer too.

 

Yes, but I wanted to see how Shiver's heroic ability would do when combined with "Illusory Path"- +2 MP for monsters to enter any space adjacent to both me and a token! It was beautiful around the water spaces- goblin archers could only move 1 or 2 spaces.

 

I had the same idea. But since images token are really easy to hit and damages a lot the conjurer, I'm not so sure it's so powerfull.



#27 Whitewing

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 04:36 PM

 

 

 

 

 

Next time, try High Mage Quellen as the conjurer. All that stamina.....

 

 

He makes one hell of a geomancer too.

 

Yes, but I wanted to see how Shiver's heroic ability would do when combined with "Illusory Path"- +2 MP for monsters to enter any space adjacent to both me and a token! It was beautiful around the water spaces- goblin archers could only move 1 or 2 spaces.

 

I had the same idea. But since images token are really easy to hit and damages a lot the conjurer, I'm not so sure it's so powerfull.

 

 

It sounds not bad to me, it doesn't take an action to summon the tokens, just stamina, so as long as you can keep your stamina up, you can spend stamina to waste enemy actions inefficiently.



#28 Zaltyre

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 05:45 PM

It sounds not bad to me, it doesn't take an action to summon the tokens, just stamina, so as long as you can keep your stamina up, you can spend stamina to waste enemy actions inefficiently.

That's exactly how I see it- and don't forget, the first image token is actually free. You can summon 2 for just 1 fatigue- 3 for 3 total.



#29 cinos

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 08:58 AM

I would love it if they at least provided updated quest guides in pdf form.

 

As to nerf packs, depending on price (which would have to be low, since they're in essence correcting their own mistakes), I might be persuaded to get one. :P



#30 Zaltyre

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 08:31 PM

I would love it if they at least provided updated quest guides in pdf form.

FFG doesn't generally release the quest guides electronically, as they try to keep them from being distributed to people who haven't bought the game. The updates are released in the errata and FAQ documents- I don't have a problem using them in conjunction with the quest guide.



#31 cinos

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 12:56 AM

 

I would love it if they at least provided updated quest guides in pdf form.

FFG doesn't generally release the quest guides electronically, as they try to keep them from being distributed to people who haven't bought the game. The updates are released in the errata and FAQ documents- I don't have a problem using them in conjunction with the quest guide.

 

 

We've been down this road before in the other thread. :P

 

I'll refrain from repeating my reasons again here, since I don't want to clog up the thread with side topics. :)



#32 AiriusTorpora

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 08:05 AM

So back to the original topic.... what needs nerfs and what needs some minor buffs to level set balance?



#33 rugal

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:09 PM

My opinion

 

Downgraded

 

Bard

skills shouldn't affect ko-ed heroes (or activate at the start of the hero turn and no the end)

Understudy symbols should be inverted

 

Treasure hunter

Sleight of hand should have this text added after the "exotic or bow equipped" " ,if you have 2 or more search cards (face up or face down)"

 

Upgraded

 

berserker

Basic skill shouldn't need action but use after declaring an attack before rolling dice

Counter attack should be usable if the monster is within 2 space and the hero has reach.

 

Stalker

set trap should have this text added after "suffer 1 damage" "and loses 1 mouvement point.

Upper hand should not cost any fatigue

 

Thief

except the starting equippement, there is no other sword with the range icon. there should be some, so dirty tricks could be fun to use.

 

Necromancer

Too much to change, class should be fully remade (I'm on it)

 

Spiritspeaker

Stone skin should be usable after rolling defense dice and add the result of 1 grey die to the result of the defense.

Text of tempest should be replaced by "action, 2 fatigue. Each hero within 3 spaces of you recovers 1 heart. Then test willpower. If you pass, each monster within 3 spaces suffers 2 damage"



#34 Whitewing

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:20 PM

My opinion

 

Downgraded

 

Bard

skills shouldn't affect ko-ed heroes (or activate at the start of the hero turn and no the end)

Understudy symbols should be inverted

 

Treasure hunter

Sleight of hand should have this text added after the "exotic or bow equipped" " ,if you have 2 or more search cards (face up or face down)"

 

Upgraded

 

berserker

Basic skill shouldn't need action but use after declaring an attack before rolling dice

Counter attack should be usable if the monster is within 2 space and the hero has reach.

 

Stalker

set trap should have this text added after "suffer 1 damage" "and loses 1 mouvement point.

Upper hand should not cost any fatigue

 

Thief

except the starting equippement, there is no other sword with the range icon. there should be some, so dirty tricks could be fun to use.

 

Necromancer

Too much to change, class should be fully remade (I'm on it)

 

Spiritspeaker

Stone skin should be usable after rolling defense dice and add the result of 1 grey die to the result of the defense.

Text of tempest should be replaced by "action, 2 fatigue. Each hero within 3 spaces of you recovers 1 heart. Then test willpower. If you pass, each monster within 3 spaces suffers 2 damage"

 

I disagree with the bard nerf.

 

On the treasure hunter, I agree that the sleight of hand skill is absurdly good, but I'm unsure that this specific nerf is called for. If you feel it needs to be nerfed, I would do so by limiting the treasure hunter to exotic weapons in particular: disallow bows.

 

I'm fine with your change to Rage for the berserker, although I would word it differently. I understand your intent. I agree with counter attack and reach weapons as well.

 

I'm unsure on the stalker, I haven't played with the class much and don't know how balance works on it.

 

I have no real opinions on the rest of your comments.



#35 rugal

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:21 PM

for the overlord cards', some addition should be made too.

 

Saboteur

Curse of the monkey god should be extended to doors and if the hero passes the test, the OL draw an OL card

 

Shadowmancer

treacherous shadow should have this text added "if at least 1 hero passes, draw 1 OL card"

 

Magus

Word of pain should inflict 3 damage if the test is missed (at least 2)


Edited by rugal, 24 August 2014 - 02:53 PM.


#36 rugal

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:24 PM

The bard has a big problem : since he is in the team, he can always stand up for free all heroes and the "all heroes knocked out" victory condition is no more finally.

 

So, there's a trouble here.

 

And for understudy, it does not synergize with the base skill, weird, no ? Without any other heal, it's useless.

 

and limiting TH to exotic only doesn't really change anything.


Edited by rugal, 23 August 2014 - 02:25 PM.


#37 s1n

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 12:06 PM

I often thought about difficulty levels. Such as add +1 brown die to all monsters in act 1 and +1 gray die to all monsters in act 2.

 

That will definitely make it slightly more challenging for the heroes to 1-shot any monster.



#38 Zaltyre

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 01:01 PM

The bard has a big problem : since he is in the team, he can always stand up for free all heroes and the "all heroes knocked out" victory condition is no more finally.

 

So, there's a trouble here.

 

And for understudy, it does not synergize with the base skill, weird, no ? Without any other heal, it's useless.

Understudy works very well in conjunction with Cacaphony. It also provides flexibility to synergize with the lute (the base equipment) or a hero ability such as Avric's- which would become "surge: recover 2 wound"(which is pretty awesome) and normal fatigue recovery would become 2 fatigue for one surge on any hero, also cool. Most hero abilities for the hero archetypes involve healing of some kind, and Understudy is great for buffing those.

 

Also, even if the bard stands up other heroes, they only come back with 1 wound. It makes it very easy to knock multiple heroes down again, and eventually the bard can be worn down as well.


Edited by Zaltyre, 24 August 2014 - 01:02 PM.


#39 rugal

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 02:05 PM

They come with 1hp but they also gain actions and can wipe out the last monsters. In quest with no reinforcement, balance is broken.



#40 Zaltyre

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 04:31 PM

They come with 1hp but they also gain actions and can wipe out the last monsters. In quest with no reinforcement, balance is broken.

It is true that the actions can be more valuable than the health. However, if you've managed to knock down the heroes, you can potentially place your monsters between the bard and the other heroes, hopefully keeping him more than 3 spaces away from at least some of the heroes. Alternately, in quests that require you to knock out the heroes (which, you must admit, are relatively few) you could adjust your strategy to take out the bard first, and then knock down his teammates- or use an ettin to throw him out of range before making your move. 


Edited by Zaltyre, 24 August 2014 - 04:31 PM.





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