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Strongholds Scenario


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#1 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:20 AM

I posted this on the Geek as well, but I'm not sure if all of you follow those forums, so I figured I'd post here as well.

 

I'm wondering how many of you have played using the Strongholds scenario?

What strategies do you use, and do you play with a different type of army when using this scenario? I'm going to be trying this one out for the first time in the next week or two, and I'm looking for any advice you might have on how to plan for it.


Edited by MechaBri.Zilla, 30 July 2014 - 07:21 AM.

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#2 dkartzinel

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:22 AM

Funny you should ask, but I was just looking at the scenario yesterday and thinking man, I really do need to get a 2nd core set so I can play this one.  Curious to see what everyone else is doing too...



#3 Jedhead

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 08:53 AM

We actually haven't played any of the scenarios yet, though not for lack of desire.  I like the look of them, and want to try them out, but we like the base game so much we just haven't got around to playing them yet.  I guess we haven't felt the need to branch out yet.

 

Also curious to see how this is going for others.

 

*Edit: I can't spell, and spell-check took the day off...


Edited by Jedhead, 30 July 2014 - 09:36 AM.

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"Much the same sort of talk can still be heard among the orc-minded; dreary and repetitive with hatred and contempt, too long removed from good to retain even verbal vigour, save in the ears of those to whom only the squalid sounds strong."  -J.R.R. Tolkien


#4 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 09:34 AM

I've played Stratagems.  I liked it, but the guy I played with didn't.  It made the game much more unpredictable, and rewards use of the basic units.  I lost that game, but I liked how frantic it was.  It added a layer of uncertainty and chaos to the game.  Though people who like the more strategic elements of the game may find it a little frustrating, due to the unpredictability.  I'd certainly play it again, but as the player base around here is fairly limited, I may not get a chance.  We decided after that game to try the Strongholds scenario.  So like I say, I will be trying that one in the next week or so.  I'll let you know what I find out.

 

This is what I'm thinking so far though.  

 

Because of the objective of trying to capture the tower, impacts usefulness will be somewhat diluted for assault.  I'm thinking I need to bring a good defensive core, with good ranged and magic support.  along with a few heavy hitters that don't rely on impact to get kills.  Not that impact is useless, certainly it will be very good for stopping units on their way to assault your tower, but because they have reduced efficiency in actually capturing a tower, I'm think one or two of these units at most.

 

I think I'll likely place my tower as far back into a corner as possible, in order to limit my opponents avenues for attack and I'm tempted to run a dwarf army.  I have a feeling they would be very strong for this scenario, however, they aren't my favorites.  So I'm going to look at Orcs and Vampire Counts first, to see what I can do with them.  Empire could be a good choice though too, with the introduction of halberdiers. 

 

I haven't had time to come up with any lists yet, but when I do, I'll try to remember to preview them here.


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#5 Katsuyori

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 02:26 PM

We did it recently in a 3 player game. I used Orcs, my enemies were Empire and Chaos (as usual). I did not field, as I normally do, any impact units, archers or artillery, since most of their advantages would be useless when storming towers or firing at units in theri cover. Instead I heavily went for magic users, one of my heroes being azagh (with caster ability) accompied by three shamans. I also used more than usual cheap units to boost their magic power and protect the towers. Clearly, my advantage was that magic attacks or attacks using battle tactic cards for casters are not stopped by the towers abilites. That is also the reason why I chose all battle tactic cards I could find that work with caster abilities (Fists of Mork, etc.).


The game was quite defensive, since no player wanted to show a weak spot and allow the others to occupy a second tower. So we had some kind of stalemate in the first two rounds, since no one really wanted to move, also for the reason that every player had two fronts to protect. Chaos clearly did not field enough ranged units, and had no real chance to retaliate against the Orcs magic attacks or the Empires Hellblasters, so after realizing that there was nothing to get by just idling around the Chaos General decided to go straight for victory thrwowing every unit in (leaving just a small force to protect his own tower)during round 3, marching to the nearest tower in reach, which was the Empires. As Empire and Chaos forces clashed in front of the Empires stronghold, Azagh and the shamans happily blasted into the melee. Grimgor rushed with remaining Orc troops for the Chaos tower and occupied it after a brief showdown in phase 5, after chopping one blood thirster demons to pieces, ensuring an instant victory by fulfilling the scenario requirement.


In my opinion the side which hold itself out of combat as long as possible and relied on ranged attacks that were not obstructed by the towers won.

By the way, I had also some very good rolls with Fists of Mork, so a good deal of the credit for my victory goes to my luck, not to any superior tactical or strategical I have (which I clearly do not).

I personally liked the scenario very much, not because I won (winning is a bonus, as long as I have an intersting game), but because I prefer battles where you aim for special goals like occupying locations and then holding them, like reaching the enemy deployment zone or storming a tower. I find that more thrilling than missions that go like "1 victory point for each unit killed".

Edited by Katsuyori, 31 July 2014 - 02:45 PM.

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#6 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 06:42 PM

Thanks!  

 

I think that sort of confirms what I was thinking.  Though, I may add some more Magic based on your advice here.  Seems like a sound way to deal with it.  



#7 Katsuyori

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 12:25 PM

Would you be so kind and share your insight after you played the scenario? I would be interested in your experiences.

#8 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 12:46 PM

Sure thing. I thought I'd get to today, but it looks like it will be next week sometime instead.

#9 Katsuyori

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 01:58 PM

Thanks. Looking forward your report.

#10 dkartzinel

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Posted 01 September 2014 - 08:31 AM

Okay, I actually got to play in a small tourney this past weekend using the Strongholds scenario.  It’s definitely a fun and very challenging scenario, it really shakes up how you’re used to playing.  I went more to have fun, so I put together an entertaining list that was a lot of fun to play, but I’m not sure it was the best for this scenario.  I ran:

 

Ikit Claw
2 x Gutter Runners
2 x Ratling Gunners

Mannfred
1 x Zombie Dragon
1 x Grave Guard
1 x Banshee

Command cards: Intimidate, Chosen Champion (the one that gives your hero fear), Dark Majesty, Invocation of Nehek

Anyways, I got four games in, one practice and three counted.   Here’s a bare bones list of my impressions:
 

1.      Think about cover when you’re placing terrain, ESPECIALLY up close to your enemy’s watchtower.  You do NOT want a three dice three damage per success hitting your disks.  Trust me. 
 

2.      Be mindful of the siege range of the watchtower, and remember, it’s high ground, so it is not obstructed by anything that blocks line of sight.  This means you must not deploy with disks on top of each other or risk them getting pinned by a crit (which is more likely than you think when you are chucking three dice around).
 

3.      Dwarves have a silly advantage for this scenario because of their miners and high toughness.  We had four players in our tourney, two dwarf players, 1 orks/skaven, and me.  The two dwarf players tied for first (2 wins 1 loss each).  Both of the Dwarf players used their miner(s) to tie up your watchtower by reinforcing to it at a critical point, leaving their watchtower free to bombard you.  Plus, the fact that they have miners forces you to have a high attack disk protecting your tower at all times.
 

4.      It is actually really important to have first player, you really want to win ties on command cards.  Losing ties means they get a chance to shoot their watchtower first, so unless you completely outguess them with command cards every time, that will be bad news for you. 
 

5.      This scenario is particularly bad for Vampire Counts since their heroes are pretty much the linchpin in the army, and having a linchpin that can be so easily activated at a bad time by a crit is bad news.

I was frustrated several times by crits on my units, particularly a key one on Mannfred, it absolutely lost me my final game (if they hadn’t critted him, I would have been able to reanimate my zombie dragon and contested their tower, as well as killing at least one dwarf, leaving me able to easily mop up his force).
 

As fun as my list was to play, I don’t think it was optimal for this scenario, I think a pure VC army with Kemmler and Mannfred working together, along with at least one Black Knight, would have served me better, then I’d have multiple possibilities for a good reanimate.
 

I also learned that it’s really tempting to play too aggressively with Ikkit, a mistake I made twice.  However, the ratling gunners really shined for me, I did have some good ranged rolls (actually rolled three successes in two different games), three dice ranged is a very good thing.
 

Overall, the scenario really does change up the game and adds some extra fun, but also some frustrations based on the crits from the watchtowers.  Hopefully the crits are in your favor!  


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#11 Jedhead

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Posted 01 September 2014 - 12:13 PM

Thanks for the report.  I honestly hadn't even thought about the impact of miners on this format; they didn't exist when it was released, so they hadn't entered into my calculations.  They do seem like they would give a huge advantage to Dwarves, though. :blink:


"Much the same sort of talk can still be heard among the orc-minded; dreary and repetitive with hatred and contempt, too long removed from good to retain even verbal vigour, save in the ears of those to whom only the squalid sounds strong."  -J.R.R. Tolkien


#12 Katsuyori

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Posted 01 September 2014 - 12:25 PM

Hopefully the crits are in your favor!


Yes, indeed! Thank you very much, dkartzinel, for this enlightening report.

Edited by Katsuyori, 01 September 2014 - 12:26 PM.


#13 Katsuyori

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Posted 15 September 2014 - 11:22 AM

Sure thing. I thought I'd get to today, but it looks like it will be next week sometime instead.


Had you any chance to do the battle in the meanwhile, Mecha?

Edited by Katsuyori, 15 September 2014 - 11:23 AM.


#14 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 19 September 2014 - 02:41 AM

Thanks for the report.  I honestly hadn't even thought about the impact of miners on this format; they didn't exist when it was released, so they hadn't entered into my calculations.  They do seem like they would give a huge advantage to Dwarves, though. :blink:

 

To be honest, dwarves do very well in strongholds generally. Protecting a fixed point on the board is something of a dwarven speciality between Guard units and the ancestor statue.



#15 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 19 September 2014 - 01:37 PM

 

Sure thing. I thought I'd get to today, but it looks like it will be next week sometime instead.


Had you any chance to do the battle in the meanwhile, Mecha?

 

 

 

Sorry, I sort of forgot about this post...

 

I did get to play, but unfortunately, I did so poorly in that game that I don't feel like I truly got a taste of the scenario.  I played as the Vampire Counts, and unfortunately, when I use them I either kick butt, or I get tabled.  This was the later.  I got obliterated.  The towers didn't even really come into play.

 

To be honest, it had been a while since I played and I made a few really pathetic blunders.  For instance, I was so focused on getting some units into my graveyard, that I never really utilized my zombie dragon too it's fullest effect.  Here I am, sitting around with a 500lb gorilla in my back field, and I'm worried about getting my skeletons back onto the field with Khemler...

 

Anyway, I don't know when I'll get to try this scenario again at this point.  I basically play on my lunch breaks, when and if, the one other player in my community is available.  Sometimes that means I play 1-2 times a week, sometimes it means I'm lucky to get a game in all month.  So, we'll see.

 

I think in my next game I want to try a cavalry heavy Empire army.  I need to see how those Priests work out. ;)


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#16 Katsuyori

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Posted 21 September 2014 - 01:01 AM

I see. To be honest, if I played Undead, I would do the same thing, which means bringing units near terrain for synergize effects. It makes sense. Altough I must admit that I do not really have a clue when it comes to leading Undead forces or fighting against them. I am absolutely in the dark here, they seem not to be to popular in our playing group.


Good luck, then, for the next Stronghold scenario. Empire cavalry is tough.


Do you mean the Priests with resistance to arcane damage? I think my brother led them into the field against me some time, and they annoyed me immensely. As did the Knight Panthers.

Edited by Katsuyori, 21 September 2014 - 01:03 AM.





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