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Huge Ships and EP's


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#1 Lilikin

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 05:56 AM

Firstly, I am not asking what  you THINK would happen I am asking what you would LIKE to happen.  Lets not get to caught up on finite balance just a feel for new dynamics that would be fun to play with.

 

here are my questions

 

1. Imperial Huge ships:  We all think there is going to be two announced at Gen Con, the rebels have a 3 and a 2 EP each what would you prefer the Imperials to be and Why?

 

Huge Ship Upgrade cards worth EP points

 

2. Would you like to have EP cards in the game that added a lot of extra functionality to the given small/Large/Huge ship but cost regular points as well as EP, if so what would they do?

 

My Answers

 

1.  Either 5, 0 (only one ship) I think Imps need to be big and nasty and a larger more powerful ship would really give that feeling to the players

OR 4, 1 big imperial as before but not quite so big if the small was the Gozanti it just looks good. :)

 

2. For example one I could think of would be a carrier being able to then spawn more Academy pilots (for imps) (under given conditions say energy, the launch area clear and not damaged (adding an extra dimension to the Meta))

 

OR Missile/Torpedo bays with energy cost rechargeable missiles 

 

Or ability to recharge small/medium ships torpedo/missiles if they come to land (new mechanic would need to really think about it) (think when the empire are looking for the Falcon in the asteroid field) 


Edited by Lilikin, 21 July 2014 - 06:01 AM.

Wait lassie what's that noise? A few people telling FFG on a forum how to make their own games, well lassie that told them

I have three more ships than you so my opinion is twice as valid!!

#2 Rapture

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 06:14 AM

Spawning new units is usually the easiest way to inadvertently unbalance a game. I really hope that they don't go in that direction.



#3 Lilikin

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 06:20 AM

What would you have instead then?

 

Spawning a set number of Ships for a slightly reduced cost with the proviso that A) you might not get them all launched B) they arrive one at a time would be fun that was my thought


Wait lassie what's that noise? A few people telling FFG on a forum how to make their own games, well lassie that told them

I have three more ships than you so my opinion is twice as valid!!

#4 Filter

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 07:50 AM

Don't deploy fighters at the start of the game. They're on board the carrier ship. After turn 1, you may deploy up to 2 fighters from your list a turn within range 1-2 of the carrier as long as each fighter doesn't overlap an obstacle or another ship.

#5 Punning Pundit

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 12:34 PM

I'd like to see a carrier act to rearm and _maybe_ repair friendly ships. Acts to get the flavor of a carrier, without fiddling with deployment.

Also would serve to make mutions even more useful. :)

Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc


#6 Hobojebus

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 01:02 PM

*fixes flame shield in place*

 

Maybe they'll announce the star destroyer *runs away cackling*


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#7 FatherTurin

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 01:04 PM

I think they will do 2 and 3 EP ships. Don't forget in Team Epic you only get 3 EPs, so if it is one ship at 5 EPs, empire couldn't use one at all in Team Epic, and if they are 4/1, they could spam 3 huge ships in Team Epic. Also don't forget, if a ship only costs 1 EP, it has to be roughly half as effective as a GR-75. I think if rather just take Decimators or more Firesprays at that point.
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3 TIE Fighters, 1 TIE Advanced, 1 TIE Interceptor, 1 Firespray, 1 Lambda
Can you tell I'm a rebel?

#8 Vorpal Sword

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 01:07 PM

1. Imperial Huge ships:  We all think there is going to be two announced at Gen Con, the rebels have a 3 and a 2 EP each what would you prefer the Imperials to be and Why?


We all think that?
 

2. Would you like to have EP cards in the game that added a lot of extra functionality to the given small/Large/Huge ship but cost regular points as well as EP, if so what would they do?


No idea what they would do, but it is an interesting aspect of the design space. Maybe an Epic title for the Decimator that allowed it to make two attacks per round, or an Emperor's Personal Shuttle title for the Lambda that gave it the cloak action.

My Answers
 
1.  Either 5, 0 (only one ship) I think Imps need to be big and nasty and a larger more powerful ship would really give that feeling to the players
OR 4, 1 big imperial as before but not quite so big if the small was the Gozanti it just looks good. :)


I wouldn't expect to see anything outside the range of 2-3 Epic points, because anything above 3 won't fit in the Team Epic rules and anything at 1 could be too easily spammed (and would lead to accusations of "pay to win" if it were a successful strategy).
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#9 Ryther

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 05:10 PM

I'd like to see the carrier with a nice repair feature.
Repair - Ships at range one can be repaired one hull point, for each energy spent.
Counter measures - when the ship or an allied ship at range 1 is targeted by a secondary weapon it may spend an energy to make the enemy ship reroll any amount of attack dice.
Coordinated assault - 2 ships at range 1 of each other may add their attack dice rolls together. Attack dice may not be altered or rerolled. Defender may not use any tokens to avoid damage.

Just some ideas I've been thinking about for it.

"Truth suffers from too much analysis."

Frank Herbert


#10 Engine25

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 05:25 PM

A lot of people have suggested the 4/1 epic point values for Empire, but I doubt they will outlaw the bigger ship from Team Play.  I feel like Epic Points don't represent linear values.  3 points for a ship with weapons, 2 points for a ship without weapons makes perfect sense.  Their strength will determine their squad point cost, and epic points are likely just a secondary nonlinear value that limits the number of Epic Ships you can field, but shouldn't disallow them for one of the formats they were created for.  For instance, IF we see a Star Destroyer (I know, I know), it WILL cost more naked than the CR90's already substantial 90 points.  I'd like to see an Imperial Huge ship with a third base.  No grounds for that to be an expectation, but I think it would set it apart.

 

Also, I would love it if the empire had more ways to repair ships.  Perhaps an upgrade that allows a huge ship to spend its Recover action on a friendly ship?  Just a thought.  But currently there are no upgrades that allow ship repairs in the empire, and the Rebels have several.  I doubt the Decimator will ever be able to compete with Falcons or the Rebel Huge ships if it cannot repair some damage, especially considering its zero agility.


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#11 Chris Maes

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 09:17 PM

I'd like to see the carrier with a nice repair feature.
Repair - Ships at range one can be repaired one hull point, for each energy spent.
Counter measures - when the ship or an allied ship at range 1 is targeted by a secondary weapon it may spend an energy to make the enemy ship reroll any amount of attack dice.
Coordinated assault - 2 ships at range 1 of each other may add their attack dice rolls together. Attack dice may not be altered or rerolled. Defender may not use any tokens to avoid damage.

Just some ideas I've been thinking about for it.

No disrespect intended but...  Personally, I think any remote repairing of ships in the heat of battle is a bit unrealistic.  It would really take a bit to technobabble to even have it make sense. Yeah... I know... "this is Star Wars" and "just a game, not a simulation" but I think that would be asking me to suspend disbelief too much. 

 

I think the ability to scramble/spawn/launch fighters during a game would be much easier to implement and much more sensible, though personally, I'm not a real fan of either option.


Edited by Chris Maes, 22 July 2014 - 03:30 PM.

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#12 That One Guy

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 09:29 PM

 

I'd like to see the carrier with a nice repair feature.
Repair - Ships at range one can be repaired one hull point, for each energy spent.
Counter measures - when the ship or an allied ship at range 1 is targeted by a secondary weapon it may spend an energy to make the enemy ship reroll any amount of attack dice.
Coordinated assault - 2 ships at range 1 of each other may add their attack dice rolls together. Attack dice may not be altered or rerolled. Defender may not use any tokens to avoid damage.

Just some ideas I've been thinking about for it.

No disrespect intended but...  Personally, I think any remote repairing of ships in the heat of battle is a bit unrealistic.  It would really take a bit to technobabble to even have it make senses. Yeah... I know... "this is Star Wars" and "just a game, not a simulation" but I think that would be asking me to suspend disbelief too much. 

 

I think the ability to scramble/spawn/launch fighters during a game would be much easier to implement and much more sensible, though personally, I'm not a real fan of either option.

 

Agreed/ Plus, launching fighters would give a new level of counterplay. You could use that "shelter" to approach things like the Tantive without worrying about its extreme range.

 

Complete sidenote, i want to see a Rebel on Rebel Epic game where a Tantive just absolutely lays waste to a Transport… c'mon… tell me that wouldn't be hilariously awesome to watch.



#13 Corellian Corvette

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 09:47 PM

Preform a green maneuver into a ship's side would work. Epic ships move last, after all.

I don't see repairing, but I do see the replenishing of shields and secondary weapons/bombs. But it takes a valuable 2 turns, docking and undocking, to do that, so I think it is balanced.

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#14 Kaxel Vofer

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Posted 21 July 2014 - 10:19 PM

  I really want to see the Huge imprearial ships, but I can't imagine whar will be, so we need to wait until the oficial news, greetings.


"That the reward for you, don´t be so high".


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#15 Rithrin

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 01:00 AM

Actually, I was hoping for kind of the opposite: Modification cards for Large ships that introduce epic mechanics into the regular game.

 

Like "Generator Upgrade (?? points): Generate 1 Energy point after executing a straight manuever." (With the +1 Max energy symbol on the Transport title cards). Then you could have things like the Targeting Coordinator on a Shuttle, Decimator, maybe even the HWK, etc.

 

In a similar vein, I was really disappointed when I saw how big the Decimator was and it didn't have a hardpoint slot.

 

On topic, though (oops!), upgrades for Huge ships that add functionality for more epic points could be really cool. But they may have designed that possibility out, since 1 EP would have to add quite a bit of power, since another would give you a whole transport.



#16 Chris Maes

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 03:31 PM

 

 

I'd like to see the carrier with a nice repair feature.
Repair - Ships at range one can be repaired one hull point, for each energy spent.
Counter measures - when the ship or an allied ship at range 1 is targeted by a secondary weapon it may spend an energy to make the enemy ship reroll any amount of attack dice.
Coordinated assault - 2 ships at range 1 of each other may add their attack dice rolls together. Attack dice may not be altered or rerolled. Defender may not use any tokens to avoid damage.

Just some ideas I've been thinking about for it.

No disrespect intended but...  Personally, I think any remote repairing of ships in the heat of battle is a bit unrealistic.  It would really take a bit to technobabble to even have it make senses. Yeah... I know... "this is Star Wars" and "just a game, not a simulation" but I think that would be asking me to suspend disbelief too much. 

 

I think the ability to scramble/spawn/launch fighters during a game would be much easier to implement and much more sensible, though personally, I'm not a real fan of either option.

 

Agreed/ Plus, launching fighters would give a new level of counterplay. You could use that "shelter" to approach things like the Tantive without worrying about its extreme range.

 

Unless you lose them to a "Hanger Hit" critical before they launch!



#17 Ryther

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Posted 22 July 2014 - 07:33 PM

I'd like to see the carrier with a nice repair feature.
Repair - Ships at range one can be repaired one hull point, for each energy spent.
Counter measures - when the ship or an allied ship at range 1 is targeted by a secondary weapon it may spend an energy to make the enemy ship reroll any amount of attack dice.
Coordinated assault - 2 ships at range 1 of each other may add their attack dice rolls together. Attack dice may not be altered or rerolled. Defender may not use any tokens to avoid damage.
Just some ideas I've been thinking about for it.

No disrespect intended but...  Personally, I think any remote repairing of ships in the heat of battle is a bit unrealistic.  It would really take a bit to technobabble to even have it make senses. Yeah... I know... "this is Star Wars" and "just a game, not a simulation" but I think that would be asking me to suspend disbelief too much. 
 
I think the ability to scramble/spawn/launch fighters during a game would be much easier to implement and much more sensible, though personally, I'm not a real fan of either option.
Agreed/ Plus, launching fighters would give a new level of counterplay. You could use that "shelter" to approach things like the Tantive without worrying about its extreme range.
Unless you lose them to a "Hanger Hit" critical before they launch!

I could see the hanger being a place to load and unload ships. If it is an option I think the damage deck must have something like a hanger hit. While the ships are in dock they cannot shoot or be shot at and can be repaired 1 hull a turn for an energy and an action. Also there would need to be a limit on ships in dock. That sounds fun. The other problem would be rules for launching and returning ships to and from the dock. It might be too complex to implement.

"Truth suffers from too much analysis."

Frank Herbert


#18 Mikael Hasselstein

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Posted 23 July 2014 - 02:09 AM

For my part, I'm hoping for a 4/1.

 

A 4 for a Lancer-class frigate, which is actually a brute to fight against. It would have a lot of relatively small anti-starfighter weapons, with individual 90deg. firing arcs, mostly on its broadsides.

 

And then a BFF-1 Bulk Freighter, which is big, bulky, and only dangerous because you don't want it to run you over, but is otherwise not particularly upgradable.






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