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A Couple Questions about combat abilities


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#1 Mikmaxs

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 12:27 PM

Most of these involve questions I had for Duel Wielding...

 

Question 1:

What is the point of Dual Shot/Dual Strike, as opposed to making two separate attacks?

 

Question 2: (This is more of a combo-question:)

How do these abilities work with each other?

Two Weapon Wielder (Melee) and Swift Attack/Lightning Attack

Swift/Lightning Attack and Dual Strike

Two Weapon Wielder (Ballistic) and Semi-Auto

Lastly, a Red Dot Laser Sight and Dual Shot

 

Question 3:

When I stun an enemy, (Say, with the Shocking ability) does the stun count from your turn or theirs? (So, if they were stunned for one round, would they cease to be stunned at the end of their turn (And therefore nobody gets bonuses for attacking them anymore) or do they cease to be stunned at the end of my turn?


Edited by Mikmaxs, 26 June 2014 - 12:45 PM.


#2 Covered in Weasels

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 04:37 PM

  1. From the Dark Heresy Errata (available for download from the online support page) modification to the Dual Shot Talent: “If you hit, the target’s armour gets applied as normal to both hits individually, but Toughness only counts once against the combined damage rolls of both hits. A single successful Dodge Test from the target will avoid both shots.” Your attack is easier to dodge but inflicts more damage, and it's particularly strong against high-Toughness targets.
  2. In order:
    1. You only get the extra attacks from Swift/Lightning Attack with one of your weapons. The off-hand weapon only gets one attack.
    2. The Dual Strike talent text specifies that you only get a single attack with each weapon.
    3. You can make Semi-Auto Bursts with both weapons.
    4. You only get the +10 bonus from one red-dot sight, even if both guns have a sight (also from the errata document).
  3. I believe the enemy is stunned until the BEGINNING of YOUR next turn, though I'll have to check that (post will be edited once I know for sure).

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#3 Mikmaxs

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 09:12 PM

Also, and I'm doubting this but wanted to ask:

Is there a Melee equivalent for Gunslinger? It seems odd that you can wield dual pistols with no penalties, but not two Close Combat weapons. (I can't find anything, but I wanted to check just in case I am missing something.)



#4 Darth Smeg

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Posted 27 June 2014 - 12:11 AM

Not in Dark Heresy, but the Bladedancer Talent was introduced in later games in the 40K line, which does the same as Gunslinger for melee weapons. There is also a variant called Sidearm, for those who like to use one of each :)

 

You could easily introduce these talents to DH, but this would be a House Rule.


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#5 Covered in Weasels

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 08:53 PM

The Dark Heresy 2 beta had a talent called Two-weapon Master, which rolled the effects of Blade Dancer, Gunslinger and Sidearm into one talent. I prefer this version myself because it gives players more flexibility, even if it is a little less realistic.

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#6 Angel of Death

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 06:33 PM

Blade Dancer Paragon Talent from Ascension?


"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast, And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill, And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"

 


#7 borithan

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 03:29 AM

Also, and I'm doubting this but wanted to ask:

Is there a Melee equivalent for Gunslinger? It seems odd that you can wield dual pistols with no penalties, but not two Close Combat weapons. (I can't find anything, but I wanted to check just in case I am missing something.)

Personally I hold the position that Swift/Lightning Attack and two weapon wielding were not originally intended to stack. This is one of the reasons for it, as I see the idea being that if you wanted to prioritise melee you were meant to go the Swift/Lightning attack route while Two-Fisted Gunslingers should go for Two Weapon wielding.

 

Though it also could be argued that as dual wielding melee characters will get 4 attack rolls at peak, vs a maximum of 2 for ranged dual wielders, means they don't really need the additional +10 for negating all the penalties for dual wielding (though on the other side, duel wielding 2 decent full auto weapons has the potential be a heck of a lot more deadly than 4 attacks with a melee weapon).



#8 Mikmaxs

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 08:39 PM

 

Also, and I'm doubting this but wanted to ask:

Is there a Melee equivalent for Gunslinger? It seems odd that you can wield dual pistols with no penalties, but not two Close Combat weapons. (I can't find anything, but I wanted to check just in case I am missing something.)

Personally I hold the position that Swift/Lightning Attack and two weapon wielding were not originally intended to stack. This is one of the reasons for it, as I see the idea being that if you wanted to prioritise melee you were meant to go the Swift/Lightning attack route while Two-Fisted Gunslingers should go for Two Weapon wielding.

 

Though it also could be argued that as dual wielding melee characters will get 4 attack rolls at peak, vs a maximum of 2 for ranged dual wielders, means they don't really need the additional +10 for negating all the penalties for dual wielding (though on the other side, duel wielding 2 decent full auto weapons has the potential be a heck of a lot more deadly than 4 attacks with a melee weapon).

 

One of our player assassin's bought Two-Weapon Weilder (Ballistic), Gunslinger, two Recoil Gloves, and two Shotguns. And Quick-Draw, and Crack Shot. Plus, he's pumped 850 EXP into Ballistic Skill, along with his naturally great stat roll of something like 37 or 38. 

At point-blank, even just at level 4, he's holy terror. 



#9 Santiago

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 10:39 AM

Oh, just engage that Assassin in melee, wouldn't be able to use his (basic weapon) shotguns anymore, recoil gloves or not...



#10 Mikmaxs

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 11:17 AM

Oh, just engage that Assassin in melee, wouldn't be able to use his (basic weapon) shotguns anymore, recoil gloves or not...


That's the plan. Long-range works equally well. :)




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