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Epic play is...ok.


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#1 JJFDVORAK

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:46 AM

So I played my first Epic game last night. I had 250pts of Empire and by brother had 250 of Rebels including the Transport. We played on a 3x6 board. We played about 5-6 turns and had to call it a draw as our flgs was closing soon. Anyway I think the thing I took away from the experience was that it was long. Not that we didn't have a good time, but just that the action was slow getting started and that the transport is pretty hard to kill when it is constantly getting shields back. I feel like it took alot longer to play than 2.5 100pt games. Also I was a little confused as to what some of the Transports actions represented. For example when a ship "focuses", I can understand that the pilot is concentrating and therefore shoots/defends better. What is happening when a transport "jams" or "reinforces" that gives an enemy 2 stress and adds an evade result to every attack that hits you that whole turn respectively. What is going on to make those results happen? It does not make sense to me, so maybe you guys can enlighten me. Thanks

#2 Aminar

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:52 AM

Jam is basically computer buggery. Mess with ths coms, mess with the sensors, pilot gets stressed.
Reinforce is thickening shields in that section battening down the hatches, etc. Even if all the shield tokens are gone it can mean you cranked power into them to get them going for that section.

As for it taking a long time. It can, but it doesn't need to be slow. Players should really always be working to fit in as many turns as possible. Situations where you need to hem and haw over possibilities should be rare once you have a good feel for the game. That said, Epic Games will always be long. Long enough to watch a Star Wars movie in most of the time.

#3 Forgottenlore

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:53 AM

Jamming represents assorted electronic countermeasures, messing with the enemy radar, throwing out static to block his communications, stuff like that that makes it much harder to fly effectively.

Reinforce is just that. Throwing extra energy into the shields to supercharge them temporarily. Since the shields are temporarily stronger they can android an extra damage point that turn. They choose to represent it as an extra evade result because that made the rules for it work simpler than trying to add temporary shield counters.
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#4 Suchibu

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:54 AM

I have played two games and I keep the rule book handy. I had my butt handed to me last game. I started my x-wings on the far side of the board and lost 2 in the first turn. I like the 300pt games better because I can use some or all upgrade slots on ships. I use the rebels, 9 ship build. I learned to keep my ships close to the transport now.

#5 Khyros

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:54 AM

I interpret reinforce to be them reinforcing the shields on that half of the ship.  You hear in EP5 how Han loses the rear deflector shields, indicating that there are multiple "zones" of the shields.  Reinforce is just them pouring more "power" into the front/rear "zone."  

 

Jam would be something with the sensors messing up the opponents computers.  Kinda like if you turn on a strong radio signal, it might interfere with your RC car that you're playing with (or TV reception if it's over the air).  

 

 

I think epic will take some time to get efficient at playing.  There's obviously different skills and tactics involved with it, and for now, we're all treating it like a big dogfight.  As we get more experience with it, I expect the play to happen faster.

 

Edit: double ninja'd.


Edited by Khyros, 15 May 2014 - 11:55 AM.

The fleet:  

Spoiler

#6 JJFDVORAK

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:04 PM

Yeah I kinda figured it that way, I just feel both affects are a bit to good to represent those things being done. Also the one title card that makes your reinforce action count as two evades instead of 1 is so cheese its not even funny. When a transport with that title does a reinforce action, tie fighters, tie advanced, tie bombers, ywings, awings, hwks, and headhunters can not hurt it at all at range 2-3. How is that fair or even make sense?

#7 Khyros

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:06 PM

Yeah I kinda figured it that way, I just feel both affects are a bit to good to represent those things being done. Also the one title card that makes your reinforce action count as two evades instead of 1 is so cheese its not even funny. When a transport with that title does a reinforce action, tie fighters, tie advanced, tie bombers, ywings, awings, hwks, and headhunters can not hurt it at all at range 2-3. How is that fair or even make sense?

 

It only does that for the fron section... Shoot the back section that's either undefended or only have 1 reinforce... and then smile knowing you made him waste points on that title... not to mention he could have taken another title instead.


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The fleet:  

Spoiler

#8 Aminar

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:08 PM

Yeah I kinda figured it that way, I just feel both affects are a bit to good to represent those things being done. Also the one title card that makes your reinforce action count as two evades instead of 1 is so cheese its not even funny. When a transport with that title does a reinforce action, tie fighters, tie advanced, tie bombers, ywings, awings, hwks, and headhunters can not hurt it at all at range 2-3. How is that fair or even make sense?

Because reinforce only applies to half the ship at a time. It's basically a big sign saying, attack my other ships or my butt this turn. (Don't get me wrong, reinforce for two is good, but it isn't broken. It just means you have to plan to go for the back section of the Transport when it has that title.)
And Jamming isn't nearly as good as action passing in my opinion. At least not against most ships. Ships that need their actions it can be good against, but the range 2 restriction is tough.

#9 Lagomorphia

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:11 PM

Yeah I kinda figured it that way, I just feel both affects are a bit to good to represent those things being done. Also the one title card that makes your reinforce action count as two evades instead of 1 is so cheese its not even funny. When a transport with that title does a reinforce action, tie fighters, tie advanced, tie bombers, ywings, awings, hwks, and headhunters can not hurt it at all at range 2-3. How is that fair or even make sense?

Remember only one end can be reinforced at once and Bright Hope only double reinforces the front.


Edited by Lagomorphia, 15 May 2014 - 12:11 PM.


#10 Soss

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:17 PM

Our first Epic game was almost 5 hours. Really long, most of that was getting used to the new rules and thinking about what to do with the Transport. I think the games will be long but I would assume once I play more and get used to them it will be a little faster.

It is a lot of though, mainly because you can afford to bring lots of named pilots and give them cool upgrades. We had fun.

#11 WonderWAAAGH

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:30 PM

Remember that the transport is only a support ship, and has very little offensive potential of its own. If it's spending its actions trying to defend itself, it's not aiding the other ships in a meaningful way.
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#12 Aminar

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:31 PM

Remember that the transport is only a support ship, and has very little offensive potential of its own. If it's spending its actions trying to defend itself, it's not aiding the other ships in a meaningful way.


In fact it's probably hurting them by making them draw all the fire.

#13 Duraham

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:39 PM

not a fan of larger games. I've tried out 200 points and 500 points, and it gets really boring. Doesnt matter whether you are Rookie Pilot or Luke Skywalker + R2D2 + Shield Upgrade, when you have 10++ ships shooting at you, you are dead regardless of who you are. Also, ships get removed from the table so quickly there is really no strategy at all except for " lets all take focus and shoot at whoever is nearest to us"

I'm definitely sticking to 55pt 100pt and 150pt games, games where I can actually feel the difference between ships, and more importantly, where I can actually fly and show off my 1337 dogfighting skillz and have more tactical gameplay, as opposed to simple point and shoot



#14 Aminar

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:45 PM

not a fan of larger games. I've tried out 200 points and 500 points, and it gets really boring. Doesnt matter whether you are Rookie Pilot or Luke Skywalker + R2D2 + Shield Upgrade, when you have 10++ ships shooting at you, you are dead regardless of who you are. Also, ships get removed from the table so quickly there is really no strategy at all except for " lets all take focus and shoot at whoever is nearest to us"
I'm definitely sticking to 55pt 100pt and 150pt games, games where I can actually feel the difference between ships, and more importantly, where I can actually fly and show off my 1337 dogfighting skillz and have more tactical gameplay, as opposed to simple point and shoot

This seems an over simplification. It does become a more squad based game, with formation flying mattering more, but that's personally a great thing. Individual ships don't mean as much, but support ships are more important. Getting out of firing arcs still happens. There is a ton of strategy involved. It's just more macro level strategy and less micro. In a 300 Point game you can pretty easily have a support ship and 3 flights of ships that move as one, and function similarly to the way split forces function.
I much prefer epic games in all honesty, it feels more like a complete game. It takes forever, but that isn't so bad.
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#15 catachan23

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:49 PM

Jam is basically computer buggery. Mess with ths coms, mess with the sensors, pilot gets stressed.
Reinforce is thickening shields in that section battening down the hatches, etc. Even if all the shield tokens are gone it can mean you cranked power into them to get them going for that section.

 

Jamming represents assorted electronic countermeasures, messing with the enemy radar, throwing out static to block his communications, stuff like that that makes it much harder to fly effectively.
 

 

Whaaaaat?  I always thought that when you said that a ship got "jammed" you meant this:

 

They+jammed+our+radar+-+Spaceballs.jpg


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#16 Aminar

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 12:50 PM

Jam is basically computer buggery. Mess with ths coms, mess with the sensors, pilot gets stressed.
Reinforce is thickening shields in that section battening down the hatches, etc. Even if all the shield tokens are gone it can mean you cranked power into them to get them going for that section.

 

Jamming represents assorted electronic countermeasures, messing with the enemy radar, throwing out static to block his communications, stuff like that that makes it much harder to fly effectively.

 
Whaaaaat?  I always thought that when you said that a ship got "jammed" you meant this:
 
They+jammed+our+radar+-+Spaceballs.jpg
My Transports only use RAWBERRY!

#17 Hrathen

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 01:14 PM

As for length, I always assumed that it would take the better part of a day to play an Epic game.  I thought that was sort of the point.  I get that anytime you do something for the first time it is going to take longer maybe as much as twice as long.

 

I think Epic play will also get more exciting with the Corvette, it is more of a straight forward fighter, and less a screw with you ship.


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#18 Chris Maes

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 03:19 PM

not a fan of larger games. I've tried out 200 points and 500 points, and it gets really boring. Doesnt matter whether you are Rookie Pilot or Luke Skywalker + R2D2 + Shield Upgrade, when you have 10++ ships shooting at you, you are dead regardless of who you are. Also, ships get removed from the table so quickly there is really no strategy at all except for " lets all take focus and shoot at whoever is nearest to us"

I'm definitely sticking to 55pt 100pt and 150pt games, games where I can actually feel the difference between ships, and more importantly, where I can actually fly and show off my 1337 dogfighting skillz and have more tactical gameplay, as opposed to simple point and shoot

I respect your opinion but I would have to dis agree, the larger the game, the more ships, the more Strategy and Tactics play a part.  It is possible that the style of play of your opponents in such a large game does not give you the same personal thrill that smaller games do or that your play style is better suited for smaller actions.  That is o-kay and "is what it is".  Look at the historical record...  some pilots became successful because they learned how to survive, to maneuver, to shoot, to destroy their enemies one-on-one, others were successful small unit leaders, who could take a flight of fighters and "fight above their weight", defeating greater  numbers of enemy by developing cooperative tactics (ex. the "Thatch Weave" or the "Flying Circus"- WWI German invention, call such because of their multi-coloured aircraft and their tactic of flying in a large circle, whereby each aircraft would cover the tail of the aircraft to their front).  Yet other pilots became successful leaders of larger groups, developing tactics for squadrons and larger formations and strategies for the use of different aircraft and their advantages/disadvantages vis-a-vis their enemies.  Long story short, more ships does not equate to less strategy, it requires more... more thought to groupings and deployment, formations, etc...  It just may not be your cup of tea, and that is o-kay.

 

Play what you like, and...

 

...as always...

 

...Fly Casual...


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#19 Sanchez

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 06:11 PM

not a fan of larger games. I've tried out 200 points and 500 points, and it gets really boring. Doesnt matter whether you are Rookie Pilot or Luke Skywalker + R2D2 + Shield Upgrade, when you have 10++ ships shooting at you, you are dead regardless of who you are. Also, ships get removed from the table so quickly there is really no strategy at all except for " lets all take focus and shoot at whoever is nearest to us"
I'm definitely sticking to 55pt 100pt and 150pt games, games where I can actually feel the difference between ships, and more importantly, where I can actually fly and show off my 1337 dogfighting skillz and have more tactical gameplay, as opposed to simple point and shoot

Okay.

#20 Stone37

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 06:15 PM

 

 

Jam is basically computer buggery. Mess with ths coms, mess with the sensors, pilot gets stressed.
Reinforce is thickening shields in that section battening down the hatches, etc. Even if all the shield tokens are gone it can mean you cranked power into them to get them going for that section.

 

Jamming represents assorted electronic countermeasures, messing with the enemy radar, throwing out static to block his communications, stuff like that that makes it much harder to fly effectively.

 
Whaaaaat?  I always thought that when you said that a ship got "jammed" you meant this:
 
They+jammed+our+radar+-+Spaceballs.jpg
My Transports only use RAWBERRY!

 


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