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Is Mobile That Broken?


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#1 cclaybern

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 08:15 PM

So,

 

Today was my first day that myself and a friend played the game.  We were testing it out and we ran into something that seemed a little broken.  The ability MOBILE.  Is that ability that BROKEN if we read it right.  The disk still moves and is able to range attack?  Or did we read that wrong?



#2 Timpro

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 10:28 PM

That is correct but in my eyes pretty standard.

If you think THAT is broken, wait till you discover the relentless/impact combo



#3 Westonard

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 05:23 AM

Or Scout/Mobile from the Pistoliers. I think that Mobile and Scout or Flank are going to have a bigger role to counter dwarves turtle-ing with Dual Ancient Statues



#4 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 03:43 AM

Mobile is very powerful - principally because pistoliers also have a damn nasty shooting attack. However, most things with mobile also have a fairly short range, so they have to come within reach of the melee troops or the long-range-but-static missile infantry. Also note that pistolier's ability is sufficiently short range that whenever using it, they have to come within range of scatter from their own damn shooting attack.

 

 

And yes, a mobile unit can move, then shoot - or move then do something else equivalent (a focused ability, like the dragon's breath weapon, for example).


Edited by Magnus Grendel, 12 May 2014 - 03:46 AM.


#5 Westonard

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 09:50 AM

Eh, Yes, Pistoliers do risk hitting themselves with their scatter. especially if you try for the double whammy of moving to pin, and then shoot that disk. But if you use the Pistoliers to harass enemies that are grouped up, especially at natural choke points, created by something like the Ancestor Statue, the chances of scattering back onto yourself are a lot slimmer as opposed to scattering onto a nearby enemy. Scatter is the closest disk, so if you are at the extreme end of Short range, you reduce yourself as the first viable target, you would only risk scattering onto yourself if there were no other enemy or friendly disks that were closer to the target than your pistoliers or wolf boys or what have you.

 

Mobile is ultimately about how the enemy is placed and risk/reward if you do try for that double whammy attack.


Edited by Westonard, 12 May 2014 - 09:52 AM.


#6 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 11:39 AM

So,

 

Today was my first day that myself and a friend played the game.  We were testing it out and we ran into something that seemed a little broken.  The ability MOBILE.  Is that ability that BROKEN if we read it right.  The disk still moves and is able to range attack?  Or did we read that wrong?

 

I'm honestly not trying to be difficult, but what makes you think Mobile is broken after a single play through?  After one play through, I barely felt like I understood the rules, let alone all of the disks, their powers and how they interacted.

 

I personally find this game to be pretty well balanced.  Remember that most mobile disks are either very fragil, have a significant draw back to their power, or are high point cost disks.  Also, mobile almost always leaves you exposed either before or after your move.

 

I'm not saying the game balance is perfect, but this game does play fast and furious.  Disk disapear very quickly, often without a chance to have the effect you had hoped for.  Defending important disks and moving to limit your opponents strategies is vital to winning.  Mobile is just one way that the game has to make that a difficult prospect.

 

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is give it a few more playthroughs before you write Mobile off as broken.  This is a great game, I think you'll find that most everything fits together pretty well.


Edited by MechaBri.Zilla, 12 May 2014 - 11:40 AM.


#7 cclaybern

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 10:07 AM

 

So,

 

Today was my first day that myself and a friend played the game.  We were testing it out and we ran into something that seemed a little broken.  The ability MOBILE.  Is that ability that BROKEN if we read it right.  The disk still moves and is able to range attack?  Or did we read that wrong?

 

I'm honestly not trying to be difficult, but what makes you think Mobile is broken after a single play through?  After one play through, I barely felt like I understood the rules, let alone all of the disks, their powers and how they interacted.

 

I personally find this game to be pretty well balanced.  Remember that most mobile disks are either very fragil, have a significant draw back to their power, or are high point cost disks.  Also, mobile almost always leaves you exposed either before or after your move.

 

I'm not saying the game balance is perfect, but this game does play fast and furious.  Disk disapear very quickly, often without a chance to have the effect you had hoped for.  Defending important disks and moving to limit your opponents strategies is vital to winning.  Mobile is just one way that the game has to make that a difficult prospect.

 

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is give it a few more playthroughs before you write Mobile off as broken.  This is a great game, I think you'll find that most everything fits together pretty well.

 

 

Yea, sorry about the term BROKEN used.  I used it too loosely there.

 

What I was trying to get at is how OP that ability is with certain disks.  It is like every game at first where something seems more powerful when a game first comes out and then expansions are brought on to balance it.

 

Played my second game yesterday and MOBILE definitely is OP.  I haven't been able to dig into other abilities yet.  I will shortly after reading several inputs here.  I guess, never played Warhammer before, even miniatures, is that Order has always been really good, especially certain factions (Elves).

 

But as for game being fun to play and a good game, absolutely.  Having a blast with it so far.



#8 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:51 AM

I'm going to agree to disagree with you on mobile.  I think you'll learn how to work around it soon enough, it is a powerful ability to be sure, but not quite over powered imo.

 

Anyway, in Warhammer, you don't really have the good/evil dichotomy.  Both sides have pretty dark stories behind them.  Instead you have Order and Chaos.  Both sides are brutal and war hungry.  Order tries to maintain law and society for better and worse.  Chaos just wants to see the world burn.

 

Glad you are enjoying the game!


Edited by MechaBri.Zilla, 15 May 2014 - 01:11 PM.


#9 Timpro

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 01:48 PM

I tend to agree with MechBri.Zilla
I can't think of a single disk with mobile that would in any way worry me if I were to face it on the battlefield. The Imperial Steam Tank is about the only strong disk I can think of that has a decent ranged attack and mobile. All other disks with mobile (Hochland Pistoliers, Wold Riders etc.) are either pretty weak b/c stats and range, or have a focus ability or magic attack instead--again, nothing OP in my eyes at all.

I'm not trying to be rude, but if even after a couple games you still think it's OP, are you sure you're playing right, using all the right rules etc. ? Somehow playing with slightly off rules is the only thing I can think of that could make you think mobile is OP.

Do you maybe have specific examples of situations in which mobile disks have dominated or done whatever makes you think they're OP?



#10 Brother Horus

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 02:42 PM

In My opinion Mobile is very USEFULL but certainly not OP.



#11 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 02:28 AM

It is about the most powerful keyword, but generally, the fact that pistoleers are short ranged and too damn fragile keeps them from dominating my games - they'll charge up, riddle someone with bullets, then get shot to bits by bowmen.

 

That said, Impact can be just as bad. Especially boarboyz, who have an impact score sufficient to kill most units dead.



#12 cclaybern

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 03:14 PM

I tend to agree with MechBri.Zilla
I can't think of a single disk with mobile that would in any way worry me if I were to face it on the battlefield. The Imperial Steam Tank is about the only strong disk I can think of that has a decent ranged attack and mobile. All other disks with mobile (Hochland Pistoliers, Wold Riders etc.) are either pretty weak b/c stats and range, or have a focus ability or magic attack instead--again, nothing OP in my eyes at all.

I'm not trying to be rude, but if even after a couple games you still think it's OP, are you sure you're playing right, using all the right rules etc. ? Somehow playing with slightly off rules is the only thing I can think of that could make you think mobile is OP.

Do you maybe have specific examples of situations in which mobile disks have dominated or done whatever makes you think they're OP?

 

Not taking anything rude.  Good to get input. That is why I asked the question.  :-)

 

I believe we are playing it right.  Move, then use focus or use focus and then move.  You can't stop in the middle of a move, use the focus and then finish the move.  

 

And I do agree eventually I am going to figure it out with how to get around it and other abilities.  I am looking forward to Vampires and Undead.


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#13 Magnus Grendel

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 04:34 AM

Indeed. Improvise, Adapt and Overcome.

 

Or, alternatively, go "oh, bugger it!" and drop a Bloodthirster on them. That seems to work, too.


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#14 Jedhead

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 11:23 PM

I love mobile.  Nothing beats a mobile Teclis via Speed of Asuryan.  It is soo much fun to move a few flips and then pop a unit your opponent thought was safe. 

 

That said, I don't think it is too OP.  A lot of the units that benefit from it are handicapped in some other fashion so they kind of need the mobile to help them out a bit (i.e. siege tanks' low movement, pistoleers' tendency to shoot themselves in the face due to low health, wolf riders' general lousy stats, Volkmar's utter lack of combat ability, etc.).  Overall, I think it is a strong ability, but well balanced.  And remember, if you can pin them, they aren't mobile anymore (in either sense of the word). 


"Much the same sort of talk can still be heard among the orc-minded; dreary and repetitive with hatred and contempt, too long removed from good to retain even verbal vigour, save in the ears of those to whom only the squalid sounds strong."  -J.R.R. Tolkien





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