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Most powerful lieutenant?


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#21 rfisha

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 04:04 AM

I find Sir Alric good as well, his deck provides versatile buffs and his abilities allow him to break through the line of the heroes.

 

Merrick's Cabal card is deadly with kobolds if you can get Dark Might out and roll a surge along side it.

 

I agree with Bento, it depends on the heroes set up.


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#22 jadedbacon

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 06:59 AM

Belthir is definitely the simplest to use - Stick with Basic 1.  Also he's decently powerful, in Act 2 he could potentially hit multiple heroes with 1 action.

Personally I'm a fan of Queen Ariad.  In Act 1 she's rocking Black+Gray defense which is pretty tough to deal with for heroes just starting out (before getting the Crossbow).  Park that insect butt in front of the heroes objective and take a swing at a few of them when they get close.  She should last 2-3 turns.

 

As for the reinforcement rule in regards to using an Agent, the monsters that were replaced with the Agent can't be used while the Agent is out, but if the Agent dies (or otherwise leaves the map) using the monsters that were replaced opens back up:

 

When an agent is placed in a monster group, that agent and the monsters in that group are treated as if they are part of the same monster group. While the agent is on the map, the overlord cannot use the monster figures it replaced as reinforcements, regardless of quest rules.

 

So if you use someone like Mirklace or Queen Ariad, use a large monster group since you'll be losing the whole group anyways for the duration the Agent it out.


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#23 griton

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 09:41 AM

That conflicts directly with their given definition of replacing. 

I'm not sure that FFG has given a definition of "replacing" as a general rule (there have been a couple instances, but those are for figures on the board, not available for a quest.

 

 

Intent wise I think they meant for it to mean "While the agent is replacing monsters, those monsters cannot be reinforced."

 

That said, you are correct RAW.

Assuming FFG's intent as something other than RAW, without them explicitly posting a clarification/errata has almost always been the wrong choice.



#24 Whitewing

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 12:23 PM

 

That conflicts directly with their given definition of replacing. 

I'm not sure that FFG has given a definition of "replacing" as a general rule (there have been a couple instances, but those are for figures on the board, not available for a quest.

 

 

Intent wise I think they meant for it to mean "While the agent is replacing monsters, those monsters cannot be reinforced."

 

That said, you are correct RAW.

Assuming FFG's intent as something other than RAW, without them explicitly posting a clarification/errata has almost always been the wrong choice.

 

 

I agree, which is why I added that final sentence. Go with it RAW.

That said, I think I'd rather have Eliza Farrow + 4 goblin archers on the field than just Mirklace and the ability to reinforce giants (when I'll frequently be reinforcing something else anyway).


Edited by Whitewing, 14 April 2014 - 12:24 PM.


#25 BentoSan

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 02:48 PM

 

 

That said, I think I'd rather have Eliza Farrow + 4 goblin archers on the field than just Mirklace and the ability to reinforce giants (when I'll frequently be reinforcing something else anyway).

 

Depends on the quest though doesnt it ! Which further reinforces that there really is no best lieutenant.


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#26 stver7804

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 10:20 PM

Split could only be the best if he's your only Lieutenant / agent. There are several, mentioned above that are better choices.

#27 Light Bright

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 10:27 PM

I don't own any I just wanted to put that out there. I'm weird like that.

#28 stver7804

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 10:37 PM

Lol! Funny, for a few weeks he was my only Lieutenant / Agent, so at the time I really did think he was the best.

#29 mm26

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 08:35 AM

 

That said, I think I'd rather have Eliza Farrow + 4 goblin archers on the field than just Mirklace and the ability to reinforce giants (when I'll frequently be reinforcing something else anyway).

Depends on the quest though doesnt it ! Which further reinforces that there really is no best lieutenant.

Exactly. Depends on the quest and heroes.

 

The Shadow Ruin quest has limited reinforcement rules so it's more advantageous to play large monsters. That makes Valyndra better. She only becomes better when the group has a lot of pierce damage. If the hero group doesn't have a runemaster, and you're playing Labyrinth of Ruin, large groups of small monsters and Splig might be pretty good.

 

It just depends.



#30 Daemon Cow

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:04 PM

Split could only be the best if he's your only Lieutenant / agent. There are several, mentioned above that are better choices.

 

I'm totally with you on this one. Monster groups with large numbers and split are the best (I think) with agents. My favorite combo is someone like Belthir with kobolds; the agent replaces a certain amount of monsters. Thus, if you use a multitudinous group, you get more monsters/health.


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#31 jadedbacon

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 07:38 AM

Just wanted to chime back in with a response from FFG in regards to reinforcing monsters that were replaced with an Agent, but the Agent is gone (defeated, left the map).

 

Question:

 

So given that while an Agent is on the map, the monsters that it replaced during setup cannot be reinforced. Can those monsters be reinforced after that Agent is no longer on the map (whether by being defeated or leaving the map through some quest related means like masquerade ball encounter 1)?

 

Answer:

 

Yes, once the Agent has left the map, the slots that the agent was filling can be used for the open group monsters again. 

 
Thanks,
Nathan Hajek
Creative Content Developer
Fantasy Flight Games

Edited by jadedbacon, 21 April 2014 - 07:39 AM.

Never believe in "never"

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#32 Indalecio

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 01:17 PM

Even with the confirmation that it would work, the use of that reinforcement rule alongside big agent dudes and its possible benefits/abuses seem marginal at best. In my opinion, there's nothing to be excited about really. They still seem very situational, precisely like any other agent. It doesn't make them any much better in my mind; from a pure theoritical perspective I agree that it would work wonders, but when I finally sit down and look for which quests would make sense with a big dude like them played as an agent, it doesn't strike me as an obvious thing to consider - like, at all - as much as I would have liked it to be. Many quests, if not most of them, either have special reinforcement rules or put reinforcements miles away from the action for big monsters like dragons and ettins to be worth an agent swap. It turns out in most situations that you simply evaluate whether you can replace a full open group with your Agent without even thinking about the slight possibility of an eventual reinforcement to matter in the end. Because it won't, things don't play out as planned in this game as the OL unless you're lucky like hell, and this "plan" about throwing a big body and landing a Shadow Dragon on top of the heroes after the agent died just seems just playing this game in magical Christmas land.

 

I don't know about the other campaigns, but I have been running the Burning Ambition deck during the whole act I of the Shadow Rune campaign [and it was okay but not stellar], and looked at the possibility to purchase the Agent card, because, let's admit it, Mirklace 2.0 does kick some ass. Problem is, none of the three act II missions we're about to play allow me to exploit the reinforcement rule you guys are talking about. Would have been the same with Bol Goreth and the others. In addition, looking at the quest objectives, there is not really any sense for me to replace an open group by him except maybe as a blocker in the Lord Merick ritual quest if I wanted to put him in the first room of Encounter 2, which already seems like a stretch when considering the huge threat investment for a guy that will get slaughtered in a couple of rounds or simply passed by. Better take the Dragons and block the passage.

 

In my opinion, Bol'Goreth, Mirklace and Queen Ariad agent cards are not worth the purchase. Like I wouldn't even touch them with a 5 feet pole. I don't know about Valyndra, guess she's in the same category. Note that I'm talking about the agents cards, not the plot decks. They all have good plot decks. I appreciate the power of these agents, but these cards are stone unplayable because of what you have to sacrifice for them to be worth playing, and even then you are not even close to a decent reward for doing so. Even Mirklace can die in one turn against the heroes I'm facing at the moment. Be happy to play them as Lieutenants instead. I think Agents are overestimated in general because of the stupid rule to discard the card upon their death. Most plot decks require threat being spent every quest (if not every encounter) to enable the plot effects and some more. I don't have 5 threats to spend every quest to buy back Mirklace, and he WILL die if I play him. If he wins me the quest would I still play him? No, because it means I get short on Threat for the finale and the quests I absolutely need to win (because of relics). I would play my whole plot deck before I would cast its Agent.


Edited by Indalecio, 21 April 2014 - 01:20 PM.


#33 mm26

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:00 PM

Summoning Valyndra with Aurium Plating looks pretty worthwhile.

#34 Kunzite

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 07:57 PM

What about Raythen? >D! ALL my monsters are mimics now! I am looking forward to using his deck for the fact that I get to do what my heroes have been doing all this last campaign; run away with the treasure!

 

But I think Zacy is a very powerful deck, but it requires ALLOT of threat, which lets the heroes make up for the crap you can pull.

 

I am almost done with a campaign with Bathir. Have to say, I love his deck! His agent is not so powerful, but he flies. it let me win the first half of Twin Idols. I have lost that quest two times before. I am pleased with this small victory. But back to his deck, I can pull off allot with very little threat. It has let me pull together allot over to play with in the final. I don't think he is powerful, but I feel he is more then fair.


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