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Can a Devastator Marine Technically Carry 2 Heavy Weapons


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#41 Calgor Grim

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 01:51 AM

RoB P171
All vehicles dont use requisition, they need only to meet the renown requirements and the GM approve it while preparing. Drop pots require renown of "Initiate"

 

RoB also has the rules for strategic assets in the field. As a rough guess though crunching numbers I'd only charge say 10-20 requisition for the pod and the rest is part of their standard loadout. This is because tank support is something like 50-60 and arguably this isnt tank support and not even on par with the firepower a decent tank can dish out.


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#42 Harpazo

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:10 AM

 

Doesn't really work with drop pods, though, which is the most common way that Deathwatch deploy. My players have frequently done it with Thunderhawks.

 

This may be stretching it a bit, but couldn't you just use a drop pod for equipment only? Like in the Space Marine videogame (though with a plausible explanation rather than making it an obvious game mechanical).

 

One pod for the Marines, another for their surplus wargear. Like ... with paratroopers who have their heavy equipment dropped in extra crates!

 

I was just thinking that as I read this thread! In the Space Marine PC game they routinely have drop pods to switch out situational (why is this red-lined) encounters with a chance to switch back at the end.

It's like how Halo did it where you would just come upon random territory/ground and pods would hail down from orbit to give you reinforcements from afar.

There could be a houserule that in order to use a drop pod it would take an additional 10 requisition per weapon and they'd have to carry all of their weapons back with them (machine spirits/limited weaponry and all that).



#43 Harpazo

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:11 AM

RoB P171
All vehicles dont use requisition, they need only to meet the renown requirements and the GM approve it while preparing. Drop pots require renown of "Initiate"

 

RoB also has the rules for strategic assets in the field. As a rough guess though crunching numbers I'd only charge say 10-20 requisition for the pod and the rest is part of their standard loadout. This is because tank support is something like 50-60 and arguably this isnt tank support and not even on par with the firepower a decent tank can dish out.

...can... can I call in a drop pod to hit an enemy? Like.. if it actually hit it would obliterate the darn thing... right?



#44 ak-73

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 03:36 AM

...can... can I call in a drop pod to hit an enemy? Like.. if it actually hit it would obliterate the darn thing... right?

 

No, but you can call in a Lance Strike, for example.

 

 

It's meant to be fun. It's supposed to be fun. The rules are there to enhance and guide the fun, not make playing the game a chore.

 

If the players need to have a candyman GM to make the game fun, then we might indeed have a problem.

"Hey, GM, the game isn't fun to me if I can't request a Titan and ride on its back into the Hive invasion."

"Yeah, but the game isn't fun to me if you can; maybe look for a different campaign, buddy."

 

It's fun to make the player have to guess at mission prep. It's fun to watch them having to deal with the consequences of their choices. Conversely, it's no fun to imagine a bunch of Space Marines kitted each with Storm Bolter in hand and another basic weapon slung around the shoulder. That is not how Space Marines, even Deathwatch Space Marines, are portrayed as. On no illustration and not as minis. If you prefer it that way, fine.

 

Not in my game though. There's not even negotiating over that. What is permissible is storing an extra weapon or two per team in a Rhino, for example. Special munitions Drop Pod only if the mission requires prolonged fighting instead of a quick in-and-out. These are exceptional missions for the Deathwatch though. Normally, it's in-and-out. No sitting war.

 

Alex
 


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#45 Calgor Grim

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 03:58 AM

RoB P171
All vehicles dont use requisition, they need only to meet the renown requirements and the GM approve it while preparing. Drop pots require renown of "Initiate"
 
RoB also has the rules for strategic assets in the field. As a rough guess though crunching numbers I'd only charge say 10-20 requisition for the pod and the rest is part of their standard loadout. This is because tank support is something like 50-60 and arguably this isnt tank support and not even on par with the firepower a decent tank can dish out.

...can... can I call in a drop pod to hit an enemy? Like.. if it actually hit it would obliterate the darn thing... right?

There's nothing in the rules saying you can't, its not got stats but you can homebrew it. In any case when these things hit something its likely to hurt...a lot. Problem is that the accuracy is dire so if you do hit something with it then you are laughing but the odds of hitting a small target or squad is slim to none.

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#46 ak-73

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 05:28 AM

There's nothing in the rules saying you can't, its not got stats but you can homebrew it. In any case when these things hit something its likely to hurt...a lot. Problem is that the accuracy is dire so if you do hit something with it then you are laughing but the odds of hitting a small target or squad is slim to none.

 

In theory, you could have the Techmarine try to modify it so that it could be remote controlled from another drop pod. Assuming that wasn't innovation aka heresy! :D The question is why - when macrocannon shells do the same without destroying a drop pod.

 

Alex


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#47 Calgor Grim

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 05:35 AM

 

There's nothing in the rules saying you can't, its not got stats but you can homebrew it. In any case when these things hit something its likely to hurt...a lot. Problem is that the accuracy is dire so if you do hit something with it then you are laughing but the odds of hitting a small target or squad is slim to none.

 

In theory, you could have the Techmarine try to modify it so that it could be remote controlled from another drop pod. Assuming that wasn't innovation aka heresy! :D The question is why - when macrocannon shells do the same without destroying a drop pod.

 

Alex

 

Dynamic entry? Would look rather stylish having a drop pod smash into an enemy squad, crushing them. In the confusion the doors burst open and out spring a heavily armed kill team, guns blazing. But yes for all accounts drop pods are not practical as siege weapons but they will flatten most things they hit if they do hit something.


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#48 ak-73

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 05:51 AM

Wait, I thought they automagically deviate right next to any target? :lol:

 

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#49 Calgor Grim

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 07:10 AM

Ask Relic, they would agree.

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#50 Avdnm

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 08:18 AM

There's nothing in the rules saying you can't, its not got stats but you can homebrew it.

 

Well, my team used it as "dynamic entry" once. There was a ballistic skill test from the guy firing them in the general direction(with a large malus), and then they had to pilote(with decreasing malus) for each of his DoF to adjust the trajectory towards their target(took them some faith, they really wanted to score a hit). When they hit their target, I made an estimation for the damage the drop pod would have suffered from falling damage and applied it on their target. *splash*


Edited by Avdnm, 15 April 2014 - 08:21 AM.


#51 Harpazo

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:05 PM

 

...can... can I call in a drop pod to hit an enemy? Like.. if it actually hit it would obliterate the darn thing... right?

 

No, but you can call in a Lance Strike, for example.

 

 

It's meant to be fun. It's supposed to be fun. The rules are there to enhance and guide the fun, not make playing the game a chore.

 

If the players need to have a candyman GM to make the game fun, then we might indeed have a problem.

"Hey, GM, the game isn't fun to me if I can't request a Titan and ride on its back into the Hive invasion."

"Yeah, but the game isn't fun to me if you can; maybe look for a different campaign, buddy."

 

It's fun to make the player have to guess at mission prep. It's fun to watch them having to deal with the consequences of their choices. Conversely, it's no fun to imagine a bunch of Space Marines kitted each with Storm Bolter in hand and another basic weapon slung around the shoulder. That is not how Space Marines, even Deathwatch Space Marines, are portrayed as. On no illustration and not as minis. If you prefer it that way, fine.

 

Not in my game though. There's not even negotiating over that. What is permissible is storing an extra weapon or two per team in a Rhino, for example. Special munitions Drop Pod only if the mission requires prolonged fighting instead of a quick in-and-out. These are exceptional missions for the Deathwatch though. Normally, it's in-and-out. No sitting war.

 

Alex
 

 

I'm glad you have a clear understanding with your players how the fun should be had. :)

I think it's being a bit critical to call a GM a candyman because he wants to find a way to give the player what he wants. I wouldn't have any issue if someone wanted to ride on the back of a Terminator suit into battle, lol, they'd have to make a pretty steep climb modifier every time the Terminator moved, and an even steeper one if he fired from the back of the Terminator, as well as any time the Terminator or he took damage from any source. lol, but now that you mention that, I sincerely hope someone tries, because it would be hilarious and provide lots of mobile cover.

Thanks for the suggestion!! :D



#52 herichimo

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:13 PM

This thread is kind of spiralling out of "rules question" bounds. If you are going to talk about strategy or what you, as a GM, would allow, please move the discussion to the appropriate forum sections.


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#53 ak-73

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 03:54 PM

I'm glad you have a clear understanding with your players how the fun should be had. :)

 

When a GM prepares a campaign, he is the one to buy the rulebook, learn the rules, buy or create and memorize the mission... yeah, he has more input how the game is run as the players who just have to make time for the session and don't have to entertain a fistful of people at once for hours. You betcha the GM has more input than any one player.

 

 

I think it's being a bit critical to call a GM a candyman because he wants to find a way to give the player what he wants. I wouldn't have any issue if someone wanted to ride on the back of a Terminator suit into battle, lol, they'd have to make a pretty steep climb modifier every time the Terminator moved, and an even steeper one if he fired from the back of the Terminator, as well as any time the Terminator or he took damage from any source. lol, but now that you mention that, I sincerely hope someone tries, because it would be hilarious and provide lots of mobile cover.

 

If a GM merely wants to be an entertainer, instead of pursuing his own vision, more power to them. Not my style though.

 

Personally, we enjoy less sillyness and fooling around in our role-playing games. Yours sounds more like casual gaming, not the style we play here either.

 

Alex


Edited by ak-73, 15 April 2014 - 03:54 PM.

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#54 Kshatriya

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 04:54 PM

 

Doesn't really work with drop pods, though, which is the most common way that Deathwatch deploy. My players have frequently done it with Thunderhawks.

 

This may be stretching it a bit, but couldn't you just use a drop pod for equipment only? Like in the Space Marine videogame (though with a plausible explanation rather than making it an obvious game mechanical).

 

One pod for the Marines, another for their surplus wargear. Like ... with paratroopers who have their heavy equipment dropped in extra crates!

 

I've had that done in a game. We used 1 pod to draw anti-air fire and came down in the 2nd one (GM really borked the rules for hitting pods, but oh well).

 

It really depends if the CO is willing to use another pod for that. In my experience drop pods are rarely retrieved intact, which could be a significant factor in allowing one just for gear. Just cuz you don't have to pay for it doesn't mean you have a warehouse full of 'em to throw around as you please.


Edited by Kshatriya, 15 April 2014 - 04:55 PM.

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