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Was so excited but now am sad. :(


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#61 ejacobs

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 06:38 AM

Tyranids and Imperial Guard allow for Genestealer Brood armies, old forces that used to be playable and now are again thanks to unbound in 40K.

 

E



#62 MechaBri.Zilla

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:42 PM

 Do you really think that Conquest will fail w/o the Warhammer 40k fanbase?  If true, then historically speaking, Conquest will fail.  Many TCGs have already counted on fanbases to prop them up and that didn't work out so well.  Overpower counted on the comic fans (fail) so did VS. (which failed for the same reason PLUS the damage done by Overpowers immense failure causing fan uncertainty for any other comic based TCG.)   The closest example I have though is the World of Warcraft TCG.  I mean with such a huge fanbase how could that fail??  Simple.  WoW players like to play Wow.  Not TCGs.  That's why I don't think a lot of Warhammer 40k players will be joining us.  Warhammer is really more about the entire hobby which takes a lot of  both money and time not leaving much for other games that take up those resources.  I think that Warhammer 40k will be supported more by FFG fans than GW fans.  GW fans are well, busy and broke.  (I actually laughed out loud when I saw what Warhammer players are expected to put up with from GW.  Seriously?  People buy into this??  I mean it really is so ridiculous that it's almost hard to believe....)

 

Yup.  Actually, I do believe that.  

 

Your observations are mostly spot on, except fans doesn't necessarily mean people who play 40k.

 

Follow me for a minute, if you will.  You are a 40k fan.  Wait, wait!  Don't laugh!  You like the story, the setting, the themes, the background right?  I think you mentioned that it was the rules that kept you out of the mini's game.  For me it's the money.  I have a handful of mini's.  I like painting them.  But I don't really have the time or money to play.  But guess what?  I'm a fan too!!!

 

The real question is, why would someone who doesn't like the 40k background/fluff pick up this game?  Who are those people?  And, if this game is going to be successful with just those people buying the game, then why on earth would you give it a 40k theme? Why not come up with your own theme, your own art, your own rich history?  Because the fans of 40k WILL buy this game.  Maybe not a lot of 40K players, but 40k fans will. Certainly FFG has no reason to pay the licensing fees associated with a GW property, which I assume are not small, if they don't think that the fan base of that game isn't going to do anything for them.

 

I don't know any of the TCG's you mentioned, so I can't really comment on how or why they failed.  I suspect with WoW, it's just easier and more fun to log into your computer and play the real game instead of the card game.  Also, for all I know the rules sucked, or finding a player base could have been very difficult.  Can't really say to be honest.  One major difference though, is that 40k has fans that can't/don't play the mini's game and those people will be a part of making this game successful, if they aren't then the licensing fees were wasted.

 

Granted, FFG LCG fans will also have to be a part of the equation, those may be your non-40k fans that will help sell the game, but again, if they were the only ones buying the game, then there is no need for the 40k setting, it's just wasted money.


Edited by MechaBri.Zilla, 17 June 2014 - 12:43 PM.


#63 Darik

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Posted 18 June 2014 - 01:52 PM

While I agree on many of MechaBri.zilla's points - I would like to stipulate a couple things. Overpower and Vs. did not fail because they relied on the patronage of comic book fans and then didn't receive said patronage. Those two games failed because they were terribly designed games. Overpower was a tarted up version of the old school "War" card game and Versus became a HUGE cash-grab by Upper Deck with all of the crazy chase cards and the ridiculous power-creep. They almost LITERALLY put a warning label on the latest booster sets that said, "WARNING: THESE CARDS MAKE ALL PREVIOUSLY EXISTING VERSUS CARDS OBSOLETE. PLEASE BUY TWO MORE BOOSTER BOXES TO REMAIN COMPETITIVE."

 

It was that bad at times.



#64 Toqtamish

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Posted 18 June 2014 - 04:05 PM

WoW TCG did really well for a long time. Not even sure why that was brought up. It was the third largest TCG and had huge tournaments and cash prizes. It's dead now because Blizzard pulled the license and is using the same art for Hearthstone. WoW was a great game. We had a ton of players here.

This game will easily pick up fans of 40K and LCGs, some will be fans of both and some will come from the other. 40K has a lot of burnt out former players who still love the IP. And people who play the other LCGs will likely try this out. It's certain to do better than Invasion did.

#65 Jvirtue55

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 08:43 PM

I am one of the 40K burn outs who is really excited for this card game



#66 Tobogan

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 04:33 AM

WoW TCG did really well for a long time. Not even sure why that was brought up. It was the third largest TCG and had huge tournaments and cash prizes. It's dead now because Blizzard pulled the license and is using the same art for Hearthstone. WoW was a great game. We had a ton of players here.

This game will easily pick up fans of 40K and LCGs, some will be fans of both and some will come from the other. 40K has a lot of burnt out former players who still love the IP. And people who play the other LCGs will likely try this out. It's certain to do better than Invasion did.

Blizzard maybe pulled the license, when it was made public Upper Deck were producing their own falsified cards (not for WoW, but for Yu-gi-oh).



#67 Toqtamish

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 05:10 AM

WoW TCG did really well for a long time. Not even sure why that was brought up. It was the third largest TCG and had huge tournaments and cash prizes. It's dead now because Blizzard pulled the license and is using the same art for Hearthstone. WoW was a great game. We had a ton of players here.
This game will easily pick up fans of 40K and LCGs, some will be fans of both and some will come from the other. 40K has a lot of burnt out former players who still love the IP. And people who play the other LCGs will likely try this out. It's certain to do better than Invasion did.

Blizzard maybe pulled the license, when it was made public Upper Deck were producing their own falsified cards (not for WoW, but for Yu-gi-oh).

Upper deck lost the WoW license years ago, 2010. When the game ended it was made by Cryptozoic. It's only been gone since August 2013.

#68 Downer

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 12:25 PM

While I agree on many of MechaBri.zilla's points - I would like to stipulate a couple things. Overpower and Vs. did not fail because they relied on the patronage of comic book fans and then didn't receive said patronage. Those two games failed because they were terribly designed games. Overpower was a tarted up version of the old school "War" card game and Versus became a HUGE cash-grab by Upper Deck with all of the crazy chase cards and the ridiculous power-creep. They almost LITERALLY put a warning label on the latest booster sets that said, "WARNING: THESE CARDS MAKE ALL PREVIOUSLY EXISTING VERSUS CARDS OBSOLETE. PLEASE BUY TWO MORE BOOSTER BOXES TO REMAIN COMPETITIVE."

 

It was that bad at times.

 

I LOVED Vs. I don't know about power creep. I quit the game when they changed the graphic design on the card (which looked terrible in my opinion). At that time, I thought it was decently balanced and some of the better decks were still the older sets. The Kree Press mechanic was a bit crazy though as was the fact that Enemy of My Enemy was needed in many decks.



#69 xodarap

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Posted 23 June 2014 - 06:12 PM

 

 Do you really think that Conquest will fail w/o the Warhammer 40k fanbase?  If true, then historically speaking, Conquest will fail.  Many TCGs have already counted on fanbases to prop them up and that didn't work out so well.  Overpower counted on the comic fans (fail) so did VS. (which failed for the same reason PLUS the damage done by Overpowers immense failure causing fan uncertainty for any other comic based TCG.)   The closest example I have though is the World of Warcraft TCG.  I mean with such a huge fanbase how could that fail??  Simple.  WoW players like to play Wow.  Not TCGs.  That's why I don't think a lot of Warhammer 40k players will be joining us.  Warhammer is really more about the entire hobby which takes a lot of  both money and time not leaving much for other games that take up those resources.  I think that Warhammer 40k will be supported more by FFG fans than GW fans.  GW fans are well, busy and broke.  (I actually laughed out loud when I saw what Warhammer players are expected to put up with from GW.  Seriously?  People buy into this??  I mean it really is so ridiculous that it's almost hard to believe....)

 

Yup.  Actually, I do believe that.  

 

Your observations are mostly spot on, except fans doesn't necessarily mean people who play 40k.

 

Follow me for a minute, if you will.  You are a 40k fan.  Wait, wait!  Don't laugh!  You like the story, the setting, the themes, the background right?  I think you mentioned that it was the rules that kept you out of the mini's game.  For me it's the money.  I have a handful of mini's.  I like painting them.  But I don't really have the time or money to play.  But guess what?  I'm a fan too!!!

 

The real question is, why would someone who doesn't like the 40k background/fluff pick up this game?  Who are those people?  And, if this game is going to be successful with just those people buying the game, then why on earth would you give it a 40k theme? Why not come up with your own theme, your own art, your own rich history?  Because the fans of 40k WILL buy this game.  Maybe not a lot of 40K players, but 40k fans will. Certainly FFG has no reason to pay the licensing fees associated with a GW property, which I assume are not small, if they don't think that the fan base of that game isn't going to do anything for them.

 

I don't know any of the TCG's you mentioned, so I can't really comment on how or why they failed.  I suspect with WoW, it's just easier and more fun to log into your computer and play the real game instead of the card game.  Also, for all I know the rules sucked, or finding a player base could have been very difficult.  Can't really say to be honest.  One major difference though, is that 40k has fans that can't/don't play the mini's game and those people will be a part of making this game successful, if they aren't then the licensing fees were wasted.

 

Granted, FFG LCG fans will also have to be a part of the equation, those may be your non-40k fans that will help sell the game, but again, if they were the only ones buying the game, then there is no need for the 40k setting, it's just wasted money.

 


"Hastur. Hastur. Hastur. Suck it, my girlfriend is Science!"
-Will Wheaton-

#70 xodarap

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Posted 23 June 2014 - 06:19 PM

 

While I agree on many of MechaBri.zilla's points - I would like to stipulate a couple things. Overpower and Vs. did not fail because they relied on the patronage of comic book fans and then didn't receive said patronage. Those two games failed because they were terribly designed games. Overpower was a tarted up version of the old school "War" card game and Versus became a HUGE cash-grab by Upper Deck with all of the crazy chase cards and the ridiculous power-creep. They almost LITERALLY put a warning label on the latest booster sets that said, "WARNING: THESE CARDS MAKE ALL PREVIOUSLY EXISTING VERSUS CARDS OBSOLETE. PLEASE BUY TWO MORE BOOSTER BOXES TO REMAIN COMPETITIVE."

 

It was that bad at times.

 

I LOVED Vs. I don't know about power creep. I quit the game when they changed the graphic design on the card (which looked terrible in my opinion). At that time, I thought it was decently balanced and some of the better decks were still the older sets. The Kree Press mechanic was a bit crazy though as was the fact that Enemy of My Enemy was needed in many decks.

 


"Hastur. Hastur. Hastur. Suck it, my girlfriend is Science!"
-Will Wheaton-

#71 Lepusek

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Posted 24 June 2014 - 08:04 AM

I used to be 40k player but GW priced me out. Still love IP and want to play something. I own warhammer invasion and its great game. Conquest look realy great   :)  and diskwars too. FFG produce better warhammer games than GW  :D


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#72 Asukarulez

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 05:12 PM

 It's certain to do better than Invasion did.

 

That's an odd statement, and the first time that I've seen it. Why do you think that?



#73 booored

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 05:21 PM

I believe this game will mainly appeal to those that know of or like the IP but are NOT 40K table top players. 40K is a relatively hardcore game, as in all encompassing.. it is expensive and massively time consuming. I belive we will get a lot of them trying it out.. but becoming regular players buying packs every month? No. I expect the penetration into those gamers to be very low indeed.

 

This game will appeal to X-TableTop players and those who just love the IP. Also FFG has fostered a pretty popular RPG community for 40K and I would think they will be very interested in this game. FFGs GamesWorkShop games are all targeted like this. Discwars for example.


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#74 xodarap

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 06:47 PM

 

 It's certain to do better than Invasion did.

 

That's an odd statement, and the first time that I've seen it. Why do you think that?

 

I  think that too and for the most simple reason of all, fans be damned.  I believe it will do better because I've played Invasion and I've read all the articles for Conquest and from what I see so far (which granted is limited) it seems to be an evolution and fix for some of the issues players were having with Invasion.  I enjoyed Invasion but reading it's rules and the articles I think I will enjoy Conquest more. 


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#75 booored

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 07:10 PM

it is a very common and foolish mistake to think that because you like something others will. People tend to trust their own opinions and have a hard time accepting that usually their opinion is shared by the minority. It is easy to say.. because I dislike something any sane and thinking person MUST also dislike it. A good example is Transformers 4.. a lot of people hate that, but tat didn't stop it from being a 400million box office smash breaking all records. So all these excuses come out, but the truth is.. that the majority just do not agree with me that the film is bad.


"People should be less concerned about whether they are being insulted and more concerned if it is the truth"




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