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Sorcery?


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#1 Fgdsfg

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 01:10 PM

I may just be blind, and this might be a stupid question, but I have to ask.

 

Are there rules for Sorcery anywhere? And obviously, I don't mean the Chaos Space Marine Sorcerers, who are no more sorcerers than Space Marine Librarians are booklenders.

 

I got it into my head to play a Nurglite Sorcerer, but ruleswise, I can't actually find much on sorcery and before I go digging through the other books other than the Core Rulebook, I thought I'd ask.

 

It'd be odd if Black Crusade didn't have rules for actual Sorcery, considering that both Dark Heresy and Rogue Trader does.


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#2 Tenebrae

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 01:42 PM

Agreed, on all counts.

 

I haven't been able to find it either, and really mis it.

People turn to chaos to get Warp Powers, after all. But not in BC it appears.

 

There's the MoT and a few options to start as a psyker, but that's it - and that's a darned shame.

 

Personally, I'd simply adopt the RT system (from EotA IIRC) and be happy.



#3 Keffisch

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 03:40 PM

Page 280 goes into detail on how to bring in Sorcery rules from DH.



#4 Tenebrae

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 04:14 PM

Page 280 goes into detail on how to bring in Sorcery rules from DH.

Not really. It's a discussion of how to bring DH psykers/sorcerors/whatnot in BC, not a discussion of how to get a native BC character to become a sorceror.

 

"But you can just buy those Talents!" Except they don't have alignment nor cost in BC. So no, not really.



#5 Amroth

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 05:15 PM

The note on Sorcerers on page 280 pretty much gives FFG's take on it "The servants of Chaos have transcended such petty notions as the division between psychic power and sorcerous might; the techniques embodied by sorcery are covered in the normal Psychic Power rules in Black Crusade. Any Dark Heresy (or Rogue Trader) character with the sorcery talent are treated as an Unbound Psyker of equivalent psy rating, with the Blasphemous Invocations talent."

 

I think this is FFG's way of saying we are not going to bring sorcery rules into BC. The two best ways I think you can handle this is 1. Simply thematic, play your character as if he was a sorcerer, using sorcery techniques but following the psyker rules or 2. bring in house rules from either DH or RT for sorcery traits and abilities, including coming up with your own alignments and tiers for abilities.

 

But looking for any actual sorcery rules will be just wasting your time.



#6 Tenebrae

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Posted 16 March 2014 - 05:25 PM

But looking for any actual sorcery rules will be just wasting your time.

I realise - and think it's a bad dicission :)



#7 Fgdsfg

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 04:04 AM

The note on Sorcerers on page 280 pretty much gives FFG's take on it "The servants of Chaos have transcended such petty notions as the division between psychic power and sorcerous might; the techniques embodied by sorcery are covered in the normal Psychic Power rules in Black Crusade. Any Dark Heresy (or Rogue Trader) character with the sorcery talent are treated as an Unbound Psyker of equivalent psy rating, with the Blasphemous Invocations talent."

 

I think this is FFG's way of saying we are not going to bring sorcery rules into BC. The two best ways I think you can handle this is 1. Simply thematic, play your character as if he was a sorcerer, using sorcery techniques but following the psyker rules or 2. bring in house rules from either DH or RT for sorcery traits and abilities, including coming up with your own alignments and tiers for abilities.

 

But looking for any actual sorcery rules will be just wasting your time.

 

Well that's just.. idiotic. Sorcery and Psykerdom are distinctly different in how it's performed, and narratively, it's odd as all hell to mechanically represent it as the way it works in Black Crusade.

C'est la vie, I guess.

Thanks anyway, people. I guess we'll just homebrew something when necessary. Probably going to pull the Sorcery rules from Rogue Trader and work with that a bit.


Real men earn their fun

Unified WH40kRP Ruleset Homebrew - Personal Notes
Talking Necrons. Dreadknights. Centurion Armour. Sororitas-murdering Grey Knights.
These things are dumb and do not exist. This is non-negotiable and undebatable.


#8 Amroth

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 05:05 AM

Sorry I couldn't give you better news mate.

 

By the way, where are the Sorcery rules in Rogue Trader (book, page number)? I do remember reading them once but now I can't find them at all......



#9 Tenebrae

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 05:20 AM

The ones I was refering to are in Edge of the Abyss, box on p. 85.

Other relevant stuff in the same book is p. 84-86.

 

Powers for use with this?

Try Edge of the Abyss, p. 82-84 or The Navis Primer, p. 100-103


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#10 Amroth

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 07:38 AM

Thanks heaps for that :)



#11 Drachdhar

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 03:36 PM

New Talent:

The Dark Arts

Prerequisites: Forbidden Lore – Daemonology or Warp +10, Scholastic Lore – Occult +10,

                           40 Intelligence and 50 Willpower

Tier: 3                            Alignment: Unaligned

Through studies of dark texts or perhaps a dark pact the Heretic has learned to manipulate the energies of the Immaterium to some degree, he or she gains the Psyker(Bound) trait and a Psy Rating of 1. The Heretic may never have a Psy Rating greater than his/her/its Corruption Bonus.

 

 

A talent I invented yesterday when I couldnt sleep, along with some experimental rules for character creation...

 

or just use the Rogue Trader Sorcery rules... Those are pretty good. Though not sure if you get Corruption automatically in those rules as you do in DH. Either way that should probably not apply to BC characters, they are already corrupt beyond that first threshold after all.


Edited by Drachdhar, 20 March 2014 - 03:40 PM.


#12 BrotharTearer

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 08:20 PM

While I don't agree with the mechanics of the talent, I must point out that it shouldn't be anything other than Unbound.



#13 Vandegraffe

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 11:39 PM

Bound?  WHY???  Aren't sorcerors the proverbial loose cannon?

 

Cheers,

- V.



#14 Drama

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Posted 23 March 2014 - 05:29 PM

I maybe able to lend some info regarding sorcery to anyone interested in it's effects. With some in agreement that Sorcery is different in regards to Psionics, how it is handled in Dark Heresy can be found in Disciples of the Dark Gods. One of the true books lending to the evil machinations before Black Crusades is even out. Simply put, Sorcery has a self titled talent called the Sorcery Talent. Equipping a non player character with one give you the right to be a Sorcerer and use the raw powers of the warp as a Wytch might do.

 

Basically summoning a daemon is one of the key principles of sorcery. It means that your Forbidden Lore Daemonology Skill comes in real handy when making a ritual or curse somewhere found in the Black Crusade Core Rulebook and also a small blurb of it found in the Tome of Excess. Daemon Hunter in Dark Heresy talks about daemons more in detail and some of the ways one can include them in game.

 

Basically, the ritual of summoning can take time. There are usually instruments involved in a summoning for a sorcerer. Wards, Hexagrams, candles, sacrifices, candles lit, incense etc... When a sorcerer wants to use his powers to summon, roll a modified FL Daemonology test affected by knowing true names or little info of the daemon. There is a chart with penalties and bonuses affecting the TN.

 

Applying psychic powers or psy rating are totally up to you and can give the effect of a empyrean sorcerer that is more than just a crazed adept. Anything outside a typical Khorne cultists usually fits a Sorcerer of any Dark god quite well and I am know using one of Khorne in my game. Little does the players know or even the npc is that he will meet his fate for using the powers of the warp against the acolytes. The Blood letter will eventually turn on him in the end.



#15 Drachdhar

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Posted 26 March 2014 - 04:55 PM

While I don't agree with the mechanics of the talent, I must point out that it shouldn't be anything other than Unbound.

 

Bound?  WHY???  Aren't sorcerors the proverbial loose cannon?

 

Cheers,

- V.

Just another theoretical talent... Made it Bound due to the closest thing already in BC -> Idolitrex Magi: Blasphemous Studies... Other than that, yes personally I agree that it should be Unbound. The issue was balance and limiting max Psy Rating.






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