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Droids in AoR


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#1 Lancer999

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 10:14 AM

Will this book have a better description of how to purchase and upgrade Droids?

 

Specifically in EotE, they have 1 small chart of purchasing Droids but no rules whatsoever on how to get said droids or whether you can get one custom made or if there is a stock version and for that matter what the stock version is.  What the starting stats if we cannot customize etc.

 

So will this book have a more detailed way on how Droids can work in this universe and whether or not we can get some personalized.

 

Thanks in advanced :)


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#2 aramis

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 10:18 PM

Will this book have a better description of how to purchase and upgrade Droids?

 

Specifically in EotE, they have 1 small chart of purchasing Droids but no rules whatsoever on how to get said droids or whether you can get one custom made or if there is a stock version and for that matter what the stock version is.  What the starting stats if we cannot customize etc.

 

So will this book have a more detailed way on how Droids can work in this universe and whether or not we can get some personalized.

 

Thanks in advanced :)

Probably not — the beta text on droids is identical to the Edge core. 


Edited by aramis, 28 February 2014 - 10:19 PM.


#3 Maelora

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 06:49 AM

Lancer, as you keep going on about this, I'm wondering what on earth you expect to see.

 

EoE already has rules for 'upgrading' droids by just buying equipment and adding it to the droid as an integral system.

 

Stat increases are handled as per cyberware.  And that's expensive.  As it should be.  You shouldn't easily be able to turn your astromech droid into a Terminator.

 

Skills? I'd suggest you'd have to spend your own XP for that. 

 

Really super droids should be the province of being a PC.    

 

Possibly the technicians book will have something more detailed?  But I doubt we'll ever see anything that made an NPC droid superior to what you can do with a PC.


Edited by Maelora, 01 March 2014 - 06:52 AM.

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#4 mouthymerc

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:57 AM

What we may see at one point, possibly in a Technician book as Maelora states, is some expansion on droids, but probably not any more than what we have seen in the core books. In fact I would be surprised to even see droids in F&D since they are not Force-users.


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#5 Donovan Morningfire

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 11:01 AM

As far as the core rulebooks go, you're not going to see anything more on droid PCs than you've already seen in the EotE core rulebook.  Maelora's already hit the major points in regards to "upgrading" your droid, in that with the exception of "built in" gear a droid PC would follow the same rules as any other PC in terms of increasing their Characteristics and Skills.

 

There might be a droid-specific sourcebook at some undisclosed point in the product line (WEG had Cynabar's Fantastic Technology of Droids, and Saga Edition had Scavenger's Guide to Droids), but it'd be an optional sourcebook.

 

In contrast to what there was for droid PCs when the EotE Beta was printed (4th Degree only, no bonus skills), I'd say Droid PCs under the current state of the rules are doing pretty good for themselves.


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#6 aramis

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 01:19 PM

Not only is it unlikely, it'd be a waste of space for more details. The Build In rule is a SPECIES rule. Droids are treated as a species.

 

Plus, with every splat book so far adding 1-3 new droid models...



#7 Ghostofman

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 07:36 AM

I think he wants rules for the purchase and improvement of NPC droids.

Like "droid type/class x costs y, rarety z, you may upgrade it from a minion to a rival for a, and from rival to a nemisis for b, additional skill ranks cost c, talents cost d..."
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#8 Lancer999

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 11:00 AM

Yes Ghost...I am looking at NPC Droids...Sorry for the confusion and if I am going on and on about this, but my question/problem is in the CRB there are examples of NPC droids but I would like to know if these are the "Stock" droids that are associated w/ the costs on the Table on pg 409.  Then if those are the "Stock" NPC droids that we can buy, what are the rules to custom making an NPC Droid which the CRB does NOT have. ( I understand about buying items and saying it is XYZ, as stated by other posters)  Do they start w/ the same characteristics as PC droids?  How much XP does an NPC droid have so that if that is a "Stock" Number of XP then can we as PCs allocate them as we please so that it is a custom made NPC droid. 

 

I guess I wasnt specific enough so I apologize for the confusion.  I just want to buy an astromech that will be complimentary to our group and I am sure that others would want some droid to be complimentary to theirs whether it be a mechanic droid or whatever.


Edited by Lancer999, 03 March 2014 - 11:01 AM.

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#9 Split Light

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:23 PM

I'm guessing Age of Rebellion will have the exact same writeup.  I'm guessing when they get around to a Mechanic book we'll see a bunch more on droids.  That said, I've been able to make what's there work pretty well.  It's got enough information to work a campaign with.  Of course, our campaign doesn't have any droid characters, but even so.



#10 Ghostofman

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 01:04 PM

Offhand, I'd say that the stuff listed in the books are essentially stock. Some droids like the assassin droid, or battle droid will have variable skills and equipment (with the listed stuff being typical or suggested) but the more common droid types should "start" as listed, with the players rolling adding or taking away from that.

 

As for making and customizing your own... it's up to the GM. You're basically asking if you can exchange credits for either a party NPC or a second PC for you. How that exactly works will ultimately influence his decision.

 

If you are making a secondary PC for you, then it should probably follow standard character generation, just for simplicity.

 

On the other hand, if you just want a party NPC to run around with, then it really is just up to the GM to generate a baseline that fits the mold you're looking for, then adjust it based on your Negotiation or Streetwise results when purchasing. Advantage = R2-D2, Threat = Chopper.

 

If you want to upgrade your new purchase, again ask your GM.

 

 

 

If I were your GM I'd probably set up some kind of basic template, then work off that.

 

Example (that I am pulling completely outta my butt right now):

Player wants a covert security droid to protect his combat-inept character. The player doesn't want an outright secondary character to manage completely, just an NPC he can roll in combat for while his primary PC hides under the table and pees himself. Outside of combat it's a normal NPC, not intended to earn XP, advance, ect., and typically not directly controlled by the Player.

 

Start:

 

Purchase starting droid: Player goes with Protocol Droid (so just use the book for initial acquisition)

 

Once he's got the droid, he'll need to install skillware, hardware, and weapons.

 

Depending on what the player wanted to do, I'd have him roll to "search for parts and software" especially if the stuff he's looking for it really out there. Improving your droids Kno:Education skill is no biggy... but Improving his Ranged:Heavy isn't the sort of thing you can just buy in the automation section of your local TaggeMart...

 

Equipment can be purchased and installed normally.

So he buys a holdout blaster for it's hide bonus, and adds a filed front sight to grant the droid quick-draw. (Narratively he says it's in a hidden compartment, that flips around and replaces the droid right hand in combat.)

Armored clothing is just redressed as "low profile armored plating." but statistically no different.

 

Skillware: The player can either just add the skills and hope for the best, or attempt to revamp the droid to be more of a combat model.

 

Basic Skills: I'd say the skills a droid comes with are it's analog to "career skills" and the others are not. To upgrade those skills, I'd say it starts at average Computers, and increases difficulty by one for each rank. Noncareer skills can be improved the same way but difficulties are always upgraded at least once. Cost is 100x the intended rank improvement level for "career" skills, and x200 for "noncareer." Failure means you've "ceilinged" the skillware and the droid cannot improve it's skills anymore.

 

Skillware refit: If the starting unofficial career skills of the droid doesn't match want you want, it's 3,000 credits and an upgraded hard check. This allows (with GM's consent) the player to add a new career skill to the droids list. Sufficient advantage triumph can allow additional skills or allow a skill to start with a rank.

 

Talents: I'd go with Minions can take none, Rivals up to 3ish, Nemesis 3ish or more. For a droid, a Talent represents not just upgrades to it's software, but may also require upgrades to it's physical hardware as well. Installing a talent requires GM consent, and costs a minimum of 500 credits (with "better talents" going up in price rapidly), is at least a hard mechanics or computers check (depending on the talent in question) and should be upgraded once for every existing talent the droid has. (so our pal adds the talent bodyguard, which the GM says costs 1000 credits, and is a hard check, since the droid has no stock talents, though the GM might also decide to upgrade it since the talent is pretty far outside the droids original purpose). Like with skillware, failure means you've hit the droids limits and you can't attempted to install further talents packages. 

 

Base Abilities/thresholds/ect: Can be adjusted by installing the appropriate talent. It'll be expensive, and rather limited, but droids are built to pretty specific specs, and exceeding those isn't easy.

 

 

It's not perfect, and I'm sure someone will poke plenty of holes in it, but at it's core it allows you to affordably and safely improve a droid within it's intended role, but the more you do, and further outside the intended design of the droid you go, the more likely it is you'll blow a pile of credits and just fry the poor bot in the process.


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#11 Lancer999

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 01:15 PM

You see this is what I am talking about...Ghost thanks, I will let my GM know to read this so he can get a basis of what to do when this question arises.

 

I was thinking that we take how much XP there is in a "Stock" NPC in the book and then we can play w/ the #s to customize it that way...so if a Astromech in the Book has say 90xp to work w/ to get the stats that it has in the book, then we can redistribute those 90xp to a custom Astromech for yourself.  Just an idea.


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#12 Ghostofman

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 01:53 PM

Nah, the game doesn't work that way. Since Star Wars runs off the "complete the story to get XP" advancement mechanic NPCs are built to reflect a role in the story. Try and make it work using some kind of system like you'd find in "players kill stuff to get XP" systems and you'll just give yourself a headache.

 

If you need something that isn't in the book the GM is expected to just make it based on whatever he thinks it should be.

 

In EotE/AoR the entire list of stat blocks in the Adversaries chapter is just code for "Here's a bunch of stuff you'd probably end up making anyway, so save a little time and just use/modify these." The Stormtroopers aren't armored minions with blaster rifles based on some kind of balance mechanic, they are armored minions with blaster rifles because Stormtroopers are armored minions with blaster rifles.


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#13 aramis

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 07:21 PM

Age and Edge are NOT simulations.

 

The stock droids can't even be built as PC's - and most of them are rivals, some are minions.

 

Even what Ghost suggests is too much simulation. NPC droids either should be someone's PC, or not be upgraded other than with new gear. Only PC's and nemeses get experience and growth.



#14 Daeglan

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Posted 13 March 2014 - 02:45 AM

Age and Edge are NOT simulations.

 

The stock droids can't even be built as PC's - and most of them are rivals, some are minions.

 

Even what Ghost suggests is too much simulation. NPC droids either should be someone's PC, or not be upgraded other than with new gear. Only PC's and nemeses get experience and growth.

You could buy upgrade software for them. figuring out the cost would be tricky.



#15 SSand

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 01:02 PM

Nah, the game doesn't work that way. Since Star Wars runs off the "complete the story to get XP" advancement mechanic NPCs are built to reflect a role in the story. Try and make it work using some kind of system like you'd find in "players kill stuff to get XP" systems and you'll just give yourself a headache.

 

If you need something that isn't in the book the GM is expected to just make it based on whatever he thinks it should be.

 

In EotE/AoR the entire list of stat blocks in the Adversaries chapter is just code for "Here's a bunch of stuff you'd probably end up making anyway, so save a little time and just use/modify these." The Stormtroopers aren't armored minions with blaster rifles based on some kind of balance mechanic, they are armored minions with blaster rifles because Stormtroopers are armored minions with blaster rifles.

 

Some very very very key points.   And not just relevent to this thread. 

 

You made me realize that Try and make it work using some kind of system like you'd find in "players kill stuff to get XP" systems is exactly how I have been approaching things. 

 

Some very tasty food for thought. 


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#16 aramis

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 02:27 PM

 

Age and Edge are NOT simulations.
 
The stock droids can't even be built as PC's - and most of them are rivals, some are minions.
 
Even what Ghost suggests is too much simulation. NPC droids either should be someone's PC, or not be upgraded other than with new gear. Only PC's and nemeses get experience and growth.

You could buy upgrade software for them. figuring out the cost would be tricky.

 

Not particularly - attachments that add talents to weapons look to be about Cr100 per XP. Therefore it makes a particularly easy transition - if you're going that route, rather than accepting that NPC droids shouldn't be taking that much screen time, then keep it simple and consistent - make them using the PC rules, and then given them additional XP at Cr100 per each. 

 

Or, alternatively, and this is borrowed from WEG, just let the player spend his own XP to raise his droid's skills.


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#17 oriondean

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Posted 17 May 2014 - 05:43 PM

personally i like the idea of having some rules for "modding" your droid's skills. like for instance taking out an astromech's astrogation skill and putting in gambling skill (i dont have the book infront of me so i dont know the skills perfectly) and saying "this is the hutt crime boss's odds fixing droid for his gambling games". or for instance or getting a DUM- series droid and only giving it a few ranks in astrogation and getting rid of every other skill and upgrade it had so it is your (faulty, har har) astrogation calculator :D should make for some funny games with a bumbling 3 stooges like DUM droid making your astrogation checks. but hey, its cheap.



#18 Zar

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Posted 19 May 2014 - 07:50 AM

Personally I don't see a real need to apply a cost to reworking the XP of a droid.   Turning such a thing into a die roll of some sort sounds like XP will get lost if the roll is flubbed.  I think it should be "Mr. GM, can I change my level 3 astrogation skill to level 3 Cool ?"



#19 Donovan Morningfire

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Posted 19 May 2014 - 01:55 PM

Again, I suspect any rules for droid/gear modification are more likely to appear in a sourcebook (Technician for EotE or maybe Engineer for AoR) than in the core rulebook.

 

The core rulebooks for EotE, AoR, and F&D are each intended to be stand-alone products that lay the foundation for running games in the Star Wars universe, whether your PCs be scoundrels, Rebels, or Jedi-in-hiding, or some combination of the three.  Fleshed-out rules for droid modification is really only going to be of interest to tech-based PCs, since the GM can simpy give an NPC droid whatever stats they feel it needs to fulfill that droid's purpose in the story.  Much like working rates for mercenary work (Hired Guns) was covered in a supplement due to such a thing being a niche element, so too would be a modification system beyond that already provided in the core rulebook.


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#20 KnightErrantJR

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 10:26 PM

personally i like the idea of having some rules for "modding" your droid's skills. like for instance taking out an astromech's astrogation skill and putting in gambling skill (i dont have the book infront of me so i dont know the skills perfectly) and saying "this is the hutt crime boss's odds fixing droid for his gambling games". or for instance or getting a DUM- series droid and only giving it a few ranks in astrogation and getting rid of every other skill and upgrade it had so it is your (faulty, har har) astrogation calculator :D should make for some funny games with a bumbling 3 stooges like DUM droid making your astrogation checks. but hey, its cheap.

 

The problem with swapping out a droid's skill after you purchase it is that it is very easy to step on the toes of PCs that have worked towards being "that guy" in the party.  It's one thing for a group to buy an astromech because nobody wants to be the mechanic, it's another thing to own PROXY and have him outshine just about anybody in the group because you downloaded the right module.  


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